June 2, 2026 – Historic District Commission – Video & Transcript
June 2, 2026 - Historic District Commission
good evening everybody this is the wayland historic district commission and i'm calling
the meeting to order my name is greg dale i'm the chair of the of the historic district commission
and we have present today other members of our committee could you introduce yourself gretchen
juror marjorie baston jasmine mccauley sima by so thank you um would you like me to get me this one i
can do it yeah i mean i i might have you double check me is what i might have you do okay the
historic district commission is responsible for reviewing changes to extra external exterior
features from the that are viewable from the public way and we're here tonight to review an
application by the barley family for a barn garage at 30 30 and this is a public hearing on the matter
and so i'm opening the public hearing now and we will hear an overview from the applicant after which
we will discuss it the committee ask questions uh and have a vote um to issue a certificate
we hope we hope that we will vote whether or no perfect sounds good yeah thanks for the opportunity to come in steve and um your your last but probably most important on our list of wayland visits we've got all the other permits um uh in terms of conservation community uh uh building permits and process and uh zba so we're here to to talk about the structure and what our plans are so i'll walk through it real quick and let me know it um and if you want to stop and get into any details but i've got some drawings we can look at um my wife mary's on the phone um so thanks for uh having the virtual connection too so let's surely jump in and plug in any details i guess because i'm sure there will be so um we're discussing a barn on the property at 30 coach and um it's uh we're taking the approach of a a new structure with um a traditional look so it's going to be a traditional post and being barn two stories um i'll talk about the dimensions a little bit more in a bit but it's 24 by 38 um and 22 feet tall with a cupola on top and uh we went with a particular company country carpenters out of connecticut who specializes in post and being barns and um really to maintain the aesthetic um and to keep it consistent with one that the other i guess relative um barns in the area uh the structures in the area and also with the house and um our properties according to youtube um so a little bit around uh the history of the law is i've got some drawings here if you want to pass this round it's in the application but it's a little bit um small so it's hard to see this is the uh um lot itself you can see it's long and narrow non-conforming the red is where the barn is in the house is just to your left as you're looking at it up the side a little bit so um we we have a we know it's a non-conforming lot because actually part of our house is on our neighbor's property which is very interesting for our house was 1818 theirs was 1823 and we know that a quarter of the line was ripped to the corner house which is interesting so when we were looking at positioning um we had a couple options but not many and we decided to put on that side of the property line which stands between our property and the attorney building so it gives a little bit of privacy but still maintains the yard and the openness and access to the yard um and we have the davidson's on the left-hand side and the libsine's behind uh and they both submitted um letters of support for this so um you know it's i guess uh functionally it's achieving a few things one is that level privacy two is the garage um and three is the aesthetic um it's mainly going to be you you know your typical sort of barn um i guess utility area storage and workspace uh it's not going to be livable space um it's two stories there is access uh a fixed stairway out to the second floor but we're going to maintain it unfinished for now so we'll have an insulated pad on the bottom in case we ever want to come back and do more but for now it's just going to be storage there will be electrical service to it um for lights and brush drawers and hopefully they're good fun stuff and no heating uh no heating immediately we were contemplating um maybe putting some under slab heating in just to keep the floor moving to work on the cars and stuff but uh we're not going to insulate the walls right away so maybe in the future um and i think part of part of the reason that you know we were keen on this design is when we bought the house uh i guess we've lived there for about 13 years we understood that there was somebody that was trying to um buy to convert it to some sort of commercial um uh i guess property and we think that this will add some character and keep it residential for a long term so it's another kind of thing um you mentioned how people's face the parcel layout um you know i think that the other the other good thing about the placement on the property before i get to design is um with that placement there is um uh a privacy fence there right now that we put up years ago that'll have to come down temporarily our plan is to take that down we need to reduce some trees um and the barn erupted and put the fence back up but placement there actually maintains the existing curb cut so we don't have to add any driveway space it's sort of a branch naturally off our existing driveway um and um once we put the fence and the farm back up we're going to do some landscaping around it it's really the best placement between us or neighbors thank you you wouldn't have to put the fence back immediately adjacent to it would you we don't have to but um we have a dog yeah part of it is you know we want to maintain yeah the closure of the yard um and uh we will have to take more than we need down temporarily just so they can make sure that you know they have access to one do the foundation or the structure up um so it's we're going to take probably two-thirds of the fence down right we'll be the space between the fence and behind um right now we envision probably about three feet yeah yeah yeah okay so um does that mean you're going to um widen the pituitous concrete um in front of blue arm because you've got two doors so you'll have to widen the drive yeah we think we'll have to widen the driveway a little bit so there's a turnout off the drive i don't know it's clear in there but yeah it's a little bit wider than that turnout yeah yeah we're trying to figure out if we you know if we what we do with that if we pave to the width of the barn or add some or start or something or something yeah yeah so it'll have to but to do something there right this is slightly wider yeah i just recently used what do they call it processed stone is that right is that the right word i don't know but anyway what it is it it binds together very well they use it usually for foundational things and um for our my driveway anyway can get you know uh you can have lumps and bumps and that kind of it has worked out very well the other thing that uh i've loved over at my place is to be able to use or know when it's raining and have their garage doors open and i'm going in the snow or whatever and sometimes what we've done here at the commission if you want to go one way or another okay and you think you might choose to go another way in the future for instance with doors that open and close with a remote sometimes we can approve one or the other okay you know depending on yeah we do envision there'll be there'll be automatic doors they'll have lifts on them so that's what we envisioned so we want to make sure they open um and i've got some pictures uh in the back and we get to that stage to show um what the at least it didn't look that way to me it looked like they look like it but they looked up oh all right thank you good for explaining good that's wonderful but yeah but the driveway is interesting it would be nice i think we're trying to minimize disruption to the existing driveway if we can but realize it might get beat up during construction uh it will be yeah they start to do it will happen when we went to conservation we do have to do some drainage work um and we they're going to have to dig the foundation so we'll probably have to relay some of that right so you wouldn't go with crushed stone would you instead of petuminous we we consider it i think um the existing driveway is asphalt or it's paper yeah yeah yeah right now so we'd probably try to match that if we could um but right now there's a width it's about two and a half or three feet that we'd have to extend it out right so that may be one or the other yeah hopefully brilliant just reduces water runoff that's all that's a good point definitely and you are in the pipeline no no no but we did get a conservation um permit uh because i was just curious what they said about the surface yeah no they they we presented the drainage plan to them uh and they were fine with it um i think that it is it's a bit of a when we talk about heights um the barn is it's going to be 22 feet with a with a cupola but it does sit lower than the house so the house is 29 feet but it's on back point of property that area it is a little bit low um so we had to go for the drainage plan right there's there's some water boiling it's not significant but yeah it gets mushy here yeah
um let's see the you know i talked about the consistency we envision uh so it's it's going to be um the exterior is going to be shiplap asphalt shingles on the roof um with the cupola we've got a color that i think we updated actually i'll mention that but it's going to be deep red more or less consistent with the color of the depot um yeah that's you know traditional barn color uh and then all the the fixtures um windows will be in the wood um and you can see we're planning on doing some window boxes and some sliding doors to give it the you know the barn uh and what color will the will the windows and the trim be uh we're right now we're going with all deep red okay okay sure um so a few pictures in the application just to show sort of where it falls um you can see this is the existing driveway and i share it here every time i have to scrape ice off my cars so um but sort of coming in and going around to the right it was a certain area you can see from the road um behind the basketball hoop yeah so we do have to take down some of these trees that we're planning and replanning eventually um they're an old way we're both so they're invasive anyway but yeah yeah i'm telling mary that really that is a southern exposure and anything will grow very well our variety would grow fabulously yeah in fact we have a very large everybody there now that we're going to try to relocate temperance on the other side of the fence it grows like crazy yeah um and actually another another good thing about the fence is we get a lot of salt they plow that road and oh yes salt it constantly right that's the playstation so on the outside not many things do very well
are you going to talk about the turret all right yes yeah so um yeah in the last page i've got some dimensions um so we want to present a little bit of colors too so this is the general style it's it's it's going to look like this um but the front will be a little bit different like two garage doors um sorry was there a question oh i'm sorry i was just coughing my apologies okay it's okay sorry for those on the phone that can't see all the diagrams but um it'll be very similar to this um with two garage doors on the side and then i've got the pictures here for um the you know the different sides so this is the side facing the yard this would be the back facing the inviting neighbors um and yeah um kind of a board not a um facing the road and this is yeah what would you call the boards ship what just ship ship yeah ship yeah lap time like your ship lap board okay so this is the uh side facing the yard and then the back roomers and this will be a good privacy event so this is sort of nowhere broodlands here and this is uh it's a critical board i call ship back there oh yeah did i say because that's the way ships are built it's better called ship yes yeah oh maybe something
yeah what would you call that yeah yeah yeah yeah then um so everything's it's you can see in the engineering drawings it's all close to me yeah with the it's all white pine that they source um and then the outside will get a stain we did make a change to the color originally we we mentioned in the application carriage red but i think we've gone with um a deeper barn red stain yeah the steam is what i use this person yeah this will be used and we'll see about the shadows yeah well we just found it works so much better than the paint well it does except for the fact that it breaks down back to ultraviolet yeah and the shadows will be the same the shadows will be that the dark asphalt yeah
just wanted to ask is the is it a standalone by itself or is it going to be yes yes standalone any um any gutters on the building no no gutters um we we don't have gutters in our house so we want to keep the look similar um but we will be doing french drains along the side and then um probably a drywall somewhere we are too to different right and then what we anticipate on um i guess on the inside so i'll probably go to the inside one other question about the the doors so okay can we go back to the front elevation um so i'm not actually does the door pop this way it doesn't fold because i don't see any lines showing here yeah this this might be a little bit tough that's just in the drawing i guess one of these um just curious look i don't even know if we uh it's going to look similar to this but it is intended to lift up yeah um but yeah there's you know i just don't see the lines that's right you know she went to drawings oh no i'm actually following the picture through the website i went to the google and google's showing me the your house so i can see it so i imagine but it is going to it's going to so this position yeah it's going to be a couple blocks here that i'm showing here yeah they didn't draw them in okay
okay so seema's looking at a google map of the lot and so i think we just have to explain to her exactly where the position is yeah i i'm imagining it's i think you explained it just now you said it's on it's facing millbrook if i'm not mistaken am i correct yeah it's not facing it but one of the long signs and it's uh behind the uh your basketball uh poop that you have right now i can see that so can you imagine if you're looking at the basketball hoop you'll see the two front garage doors at the barnabill straight back from there so it's on there yeah that's like the tables right is that operable it will be um it'll open yeah i don't know what we'll do with it yeah it sort it just looks cool yeah look at here and they were out yeah so desmond's asking about the um the um uh hey door above the uh garage doors and yes it is operable yeah i think part of it part of the we talked about you know two windows or something different i like this windows on the dormer side and we just thought that was a little more sure i don't know it makes sense the proportions are good on this itself actually i think same i just emailed you the pdf if you don't have it yeah thank you
can the heat the air go up into the cooler or no i don't i don't think it'll be vented at all but there is going to be a light up there um okay but i don't think it's going to be open i think it's more decorative yeah but and actually there was a uh an error in the application so i think the application said it's three feet cool but it's actually six feet so it'll sit about five feet above right yeah hi everyone i'm sorry can you hear me this is mary yeah yeah we hear you hi everyone i don't know if everyone was aware i was online i'm sorry that um i'm not there in person i my mom had a surgery so i'm um helping her at her house but um i just want to the the cupola doesn't actually have a light in it it is it's just decorative and it it doesn't have a light i just want to clarify that oh thanks mary sorry sorry
i'm i'm really bad at this and so i depend upon desmond uh the proportions i think the portions are quite nice yeah i think they are yeah because i mean that was a discussion i had with mary when yeah this is right i'm assuming much the score of this i think this proportion yeah yeah there was that one when we looked at a shorter one that was yeah three feet inside yeah but it quite looked right yeah this is nice what's the uh what is the wood here it's it's gonna be painted like this area here yeah it's gonna be painted red to match yeah the body of it that's the intention i don't i think that's this i don't know mary if you know the the wood around the base of the cupola is that the same as this siding or i believe they make everything out of eastern white pine at country carpenters yes yeah yeah they just they've oriented they've oriented the the the timbers and they yeah 49 degrees too like they are showing down here i think you'd want to have it red yeah you would you know the dark with the uh yeah uh as well i mean this is this shows up as well yeah right that's my assumption uh i'm looking at your uh the benton model are you following the same window um grid like the the the kind of like the structure that that you have here with the window box is that how you're doing the same windows
yes the window we're gonna put um do window boxes but the um the muntins and and mary maybe you want to jump in here around colors on the because i think one of these pictures shows white but and it shows a um a 12 by and i i think we're slightly different right right i couldn't i couldn't find a specific image that shows exactly our configuration but um and the window boxes actually did end up getting moved to the rear of the barn on facing our backyard because those side doors that we have on it on the long side of it are going to open and they would have bumped into the window boxes um but those wouldn't have been visible from the road anyway so um regarding the windows though we have two small six light windows i believe next to the sliding doors on the what would be the north side and then um to i believe there are 12 lights on the south side and then um two additional windows uh on the rear facing like the lipson's the east end and i think that's pretty much it oh there's one 12 light window in the second floor facing the um facing the east so facing the lipson's property um which would illuminate the you know the the loft area and the loft area also does have that dormer facing the north so it won't be too visible from the road you might see a little bit of the outline you know when you're face when you're facing the front of the garage doors and that has three windows in it my um a bit of practicalness um i like light in the garage and particular garage the doors have windows so i get windows i get it's in the door whereas this picture right here shows a little transom of windows um and i'm just more likely to win in the better it's a trade-off of privacy yeah um but the one above the garage door people can't really see in that one yeah at all but yeah we talked about transoms and then i guess the um you know a couple of things there's sliding doors on the side um this will open right up into the area too so that is one way we can get light in without sort of opening ourselves up yeah um we're on such a main thoroughfare you know we we're trying we always try to at least limit um yeah i think it's a good point to let some light in without visibility yeah when we're in the driveway open the doors it's this side faces the yard yeah yeah and then yeah what we envision is off of this we want to probably put a little bit of a patio down and make it sort of a sitting space yeah you know um the other thing i would throw out my barn it's very very hot and very very cold uh but um i've always been intrigued with the um cupless you know to let the heat out and because you know with a fan or with anything else it could just just natural venting yeah just natural venting as well yes it's just natural venting the heat rises it kind of goes out you open the doors down on the first floor and the air flows right up and you know out um but but if it's just meant to be decorative maybe there's no way to let that happen yeah i don't know how we would do that but we do know so we did these windows will open on the top um so that's why we wanted to at least have you know a couple of sets and some areas for cross breeze so they look at that too yeah okay yeah is it standard practice to put a vapor barrier under the garage slab the concrete slab yeah we're going to insulate um under the garage slab yeah and he wants to do that okay yeah i think mine was not and i can't paint it because of that oh really i see moisture coming yeah yeah yeah you want to be prepared yeah yeah good yeah we're going to insulate and we are we are talking about running some um uh some conduit for the slab to um i don't know if we'll do that right away but we at least want to set it up so so essentially to heat a slab you know there's there's a couple ways to do it but the best way to do it is the tubing is put in and the concrete is poured the tubing is in situ um so yeah you kind of need to do it now or you don't yeah yeah yeah our plan is to at least route it i think um the other thing we're contemplating is what's going on the inside because it might put a car lift in there so we're rolling around the lift and yeah yeah yeah but to be clear the the insulation will just be for working on the cars we're not i want to be clear on the record that we're not making it habitable space so just to make sure not bad um just just to be aware that you know you you need to put the you need to put the lines in the concrete when you're pouring otherwise otherwise it's too late yeah yeah yeah unless you put a floor above over the concrete yeah you can do it that way if you if you put like a wood floor if you wanted to over the concrete you can route the bottom the underside of the of the of the of the uh the wood and put they use rubber hoses like if you put a floating floor you can then put it in but what it's not doing is it's not getting the the so what you really want is you want to be able to you're heating the slab and the slab heats the air right that's what you want and the slab then retains the heat for a long period of time because it's concrete but if you if you are just heating on the surface it doesn't quite it's not quite as efficient that's all that's just something to know yeah yeah and after uh a long time of laying on old on hard cold concrete i think it'd be nice to have something i'm rooting for you but yeah i think um it's foundationally you probably know the steps better than us but yeah the putters have to go in first and then the slab so we have a little bit of time to figure out what that heating right looks like but that that would be intended at least yeah
um it's really nice so what's the structure behind the that's going to be behind the bar is there like a small shed back there yeah there's a small shed back there now that'll stay yeah um and actually the color is going to be very similar to the final piece okay yeah when do you hope to start very soon uh we're hoping so that the kit will probably be done later this summer and then trying to figure out yeah like i said we've got some tree work we need to do we have to do ground a ton of ground prep um so i think it all depends on um you know how quickly we can once we once we get through here if you guys issue the the certificate of appropriateness we have to get the billing permit that's the last step and then we'll get to it so hopefully this summer that's the intent and there are no there are no um setback requirements uh between the structure the new structure and the the fence um there's yeah there's everything's non-conforming oh okay
okay sorry funny the only conforming place to put it would have been smack dab in the middle of the so that's okay um back to the transom light you're not going to put transoms over the yard shores we're not planning on it no no can i speak to that first we i originally had sort of just steered away from those because in my mind i thought they weren't as historic looking um or or historically accurate but i like the look of them would you guys approve of those do you because we are i was concerned about getting um enough natural light in the barn but the we kind of wanted to go with what looked the most traditional and the most in line with the house but i i like the look of transoms um do you think they are appropriate for that type of structure yeah i mean since then since we purchased it without them i've seen many examples of really old barns with transoms so i wasn't sure well i don't think they did them in the 18th century but i mean our park that's in the blue barn you know you've got dressing lights yeah on the um cable and the bar and what we could do is you could go either either way you know from us as we consider that yeah yeah and even with the paint i mean you've talked about staying but maybe you'll change your mind decide you'd rather use paint so sometimes it's better to uh have the options on the table okay that's that's i'm glad you mentioned the transoms because um the natural light is an issue and we had um you know looked into carriage style garage doors but country carpenters doesn't offer those and it started to become kind of just you know cumbersome to to get another company to come in and and do them and we like the look of the um the plain country carpenters ones you know very traditional but definitely dark inside so we just thought we'd add a lot of light bulbs yeah do you have the ceiling clearance for that right above that do we those two doors um yeah actually uh we are we're the foundational work we're going to boost some what are the dimensions where do you know what it's going to come up i think we're we're adding 18 inches to the frost walls they're usually uh i can't remember what exactly is it 24 above grade and we're adding them we're making them um 30 30 i don't know we're adding 18 inches to the frost walls um in order to get additional ceiling height for the first floor for a car lift so it's still it doesn't it still doesn't add too much to the height and also because it's the lowest part of the yard hopefully it will still kind of look nestled in there but it is a little bit we added to the first floor height by increasing the height of the frost wall and if you recall my um garage that goes between the joists um and stuff that's yeah well i think my sorry i've been close to you i think yeah the lift lift is going to take some creativity because the way the posted beams or on the inside the way the beams come up they've got some angled pieces yeah so we have to figure that out and we have to be a like a scissor lift that sits flushing the floor that goes on another practical tip and you're welcome to i'm looking at modeling where you put them in the depth wise in the garage makes a big difference of getting out of your car and you're not using the lift right so i put mine way forward so i can park the car use it without banging the lift but when i want to use a lift i go another five feet forward yeah that's what we're looking back because that was what i was grappling with too is yeah you can't really park in between it full time no because you just don't have the clearance on the side side so there's this is just really nitpicking um why is there um an arch on or why is the window in the cupola with a mini a segmental large oh right above it that's the cupola window the cupola or the art there's another sky right here oh is that one right there yeah it's a vent is that a vent there's a vent right over the door is that what you're talking about or are you talking yes i think that's i actually i kind of love getting into this level of detail i'm totally with you on uh you know getting it right we chose they have you know five or six types you can choose from and i think we chose one but we're totally open to a different style uh you know like say one with just wooden vents or something like that because it is it is decorative unfortunately not functional um and i believe there is if you really were interested there's a a page on the country carpenter's um website that shows what they are um you know what they offer for um for cupolas so um that one it has the arch in the window just simply because that's their offering um and so i'm sending brian at the the page in case anyone wants to see what other ones they offer in case there was a different yeah there's a couple of pictures here that show the slatted vents versus the uh ones with windows well um it's not going to be open to the uh garage no no no it's okay all right yeah so
so then it doesn't matter whether it's a window or event in terms of function yeah uh i think in the large style but in the large style they offer a louver instead of a window but that also has an arch at the top and i think those are the only our only choices in the large version where the windows or the the vents and both have that little arch over over so i'm not sure um you know what would be preferred put a weather vane we talked about it they offer a pig in the course
um but i don't i don't i don't know if we've we didn't draw we draw a weather down there right there yeah we haven't purchased a weather vane yet um but i think we'd like to put one on if that would be uh acceptable um we might we can come back and get that approved separately if that's um something that would be fall under our certificate issue because i don't think we have it chosen yet
or we could just stick it on there scowcart weather vane came from the house the barn a block away that's right right it's in the shelburne museum that's right but the car top oh yeah yeah yeah mcwayland is home with weather games oh okay
well i guess i probably would you be getting to say what i um prefer but i don't think that's but the other is not inappropriate so it would be i think that as marjorie has said that in terms of the um louvered or windowed cupola that perhaps we should let you decide either is one letter either would be fine yeah the one the one thing that uh you did you did point out which i think is true is that um if it's open um does it appear like the glazed cupola they're showing in that photograph for the open cupola which you can just see through it yeah um versus it having louvers and being a bit more volumetric that's all and that's that's just a personal choice i believe that's what it is yeah that's a good point i don't know if we back i don't remember seeing those in person unless you do merit i think it's clear glass but yeah the louvers might just add a little bit more um a little bit more texture a little bit more you know
you we're talking about having a light up there at one point yeah i mentioned it but i think that might be an option yeah and uh it seems to me that to have a light up there could be a good option and to louver it would be a good option yeah i really think it just comes down to a personal choice about whether there's a louver or not it would be hard to say that any of them are inappropriate right that's really all we can't say oh i like that so do it right we have to say whether it's appropriate uh but yeah i appreciate that back to it i think i think it's a good point yeah especially this and just the aesthetic right yeah well i mean but you all do have uh you know knowledge of historical aesthetic and you know accuracy things so we're happy to um hear your opinions honestly uh you know i i kind of don't i don't have a strong opinion about the cupola actually i like having one um yeah but beyond that i don't care so gretchen what would your preference be well i mean i guess the way this is done i i guess i should go on the website and have a good look um but we're not going to hold this up for that um the it doesn't look like it's quite bulky enough well that's what that's why the way the glass is yeah is um yeah because you can see all the way through to the next side and so it just feel like the corner parts need to be a little bit bolder um in which case the way to you know deal with that is to go with the louver because it would it wouldn't be as noticeable right i wouldn't just i wouldn't disagree with what you said at all um and the other the other side of the ledger is just an actual like coming through it that's all yeah yeah that's one because it's relatively that's a bit easier doesn't it yeah yes right okay okay
i guess it's just that um with the glass the way they've done it and the narrowness of the corner post yeah um it's almost looks like it has a hat okay you know it's just yeah sort of put up there yeah and not i see that that's not part of the yeah the proportions are just a little bit too yeah but i don't think anybody would drive by and say oh my god i think that's it um yeah yeah i think that's it is there anything i missed there that we've talked through we talked about dimensions color yeah i don't i don't think so um yeah i would think we were clear that um yeah the attention is to do sort of the color drenched everything with the same color including the muntins and the garage doors and and every aspect of it so um you know no white trim or anything like that in this case so i think i think you've covered it i think that's a big choice back back back to the cupola cupola roof is copper or no it's single now yeah and i personally love the copper and not plastic copper but yeah yeah yeah yeah the fire station across the street has a giant cupola because it's a fire station or not they've got some sort of structure up there don't they yeah it's more like a tower yeah it's very large well you know it's interesting if you end up with uh with a weather vane it's a copper weather vane i think use your copper thank you yeah it would be nice to put something up there just to finish it off at some point uh so what anything that we would uh when we do finally uh do the wording for the we would uh give the option of louvered or windows yes we give the option of transoms or not over the garage doors and but we also put into the language um the option of paint or stain yes yeah option of uh greenwood windows i don't know that we yeah i mean that's uh for sure and i think that's just not something that right we can supposedly deal with color you know how i all how i feel about that i think their options are great yeah i think so too which just i just thought of something um so i should have asked before it it shows some some hinges or or or um iron mongering on the exterior of the of the yeah so is that also going to be painted red no i don't think we intended to paint that um but i guess maybe we didn't talk about that those are just black iron okay yeah good okay so the hinges are black iron yeah okay good yeah country carpenters apparently has some kind of vaguely traditional blacksmith shop you know they actually make those iron hinges on site so um they're you know relatively traditional hand forged allegedly hopefully yeah long enough sometimes they really chins on them but these work yeah decent with money um yeah yeah actually maybe maybe one more option that we have talked about um is so there's the hay bale is this called a hay bale door above the garage doors yeah hello yeah hello we have talked about maybe adding a the ridge line extension i believe you know uh one of those i don't know yeah the yeah yeah that's meant to look like it's pulling the hay up we would um sort of like to add one of those if um if that's you know just everything to make it look more barn-esque you know right as long as it has 2 000 pound capacity for machinery right right and if it happens to get used to lift up something heavy then you know that's just a bonus yeah i think there was one on one of the example photos in the application and i that's what they hadn't added it on ours but i um i liked the effect of that yeah so i agree you can add that if you like yeah um the poll a barn hoist okay i'm calling it a mountain pole okay uh hey hey hey hoist lots of lots of terms lots of terms yeah lots of terms yeah
that's been exciting yeah yeah it's been a long time coming i think we've talked about it we've lived in the house for 13 years i think we've probably talked about it for 10. okay there you go that's fine but you went away for a couple years so yeah yeah it was a job and every time i scrape cars on i think yeah every morning you scrape cars no frost no frost yes oh oh oh oh you garage your cars so therefore you know maybe you know paid into that no no no no no i would like to um move this along we do not have any public participants outside of the people here right now so do i have a motion to close the public hearing is there anybody else from the public that would like to address the commission hearing no we have a motion to close the public hearing motion to close public hearing okay second second all those in favor say aye aye aye aye we have to do a roll call because that's waiting on sima yes hi close the public hearing yes aye okay scratching left hi there's my line yeah well do i have a motion to consider for this application so moved with no with options we have to word yes exactly um i move that the um issue of certificate of appropriateness uh for a um construction of a barn um at uh 30 conchitua road and um as presented with the following options transom lights or no one um cupola louvered or windowed um
louvered or windowed okay do you want to do the paint i was going to say we should say um um option for um stain or stain or paint stain or paint in the same color range that was presented yeah they've been looking at the people and the other barns right stain or pain um i guess i should say stain or pain and red but they get it and um the addition of the uh hay hook or a oh yes
and you're calling it a hang hook huh oh it's called a hay voice uh uh i think that's it i think so does that make sense yeah i think those are before i come in does that make sense it does that's great thanks guys for that flexibility we appreciate that
um and uh should we say that the weather vane did have to come back for later then I guess that moment. I don't think it's a huge burden. It's just a matter of, well, you tell me whether you think it's much of a burden. I guess the size does matter. Yeah. And so the proportion of the weather in the issue, either we don't know. Yeah.
I'm sure it'll be a little too small, but I'm sure it'll be. Yeah, I'm sure it'll be one. Okay. All right, so that's a motion. Okay. And second. Second the motion. Second the motion. Okay, this is Gretchen. All those in favor of the motion say aye. Gretchen, aye. Gretchen, Marjorie, aye. Desmond, aye. FEMA, aye. Greg, aye.
Second, Desmond. And roll call vote. Roll call vote unanimous. Yes. Great. Thank you, Mary. All right. This'll be great. It really has been very nice. Thank you so much. Oh, you're welcome. I appreciate the feedback, too, and the thoughts. Yeah. Tomorrow, I will issue the certificate. I'd like to put the purpose of my show on PDF. And that's what we do, too, and I'm probably crossing with the manager's office. Great. Okay. I seriously doubt that there is a 20-day field period. Yeah. I mean, just want to feel it, right? Yeah. It's highly up there. So, it's highly up there. Yes. Good. Yeah, I guess the only, I mean, we wouldn't, we got letters from both our neighbors. Yeah. And I will tell you that the tiny little bit of the Davidson's house is on a historical society property. Oh, really? Oh, that's funny. Oh, that's funny. Yeah. It's funny how, like, yeah, 200 years ago, they were all right on top of each other thing and all that space. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And when I was looking up for Mary to try and figure out whether there had been a structure on the property, I could only see the 1908 map in terms of the detail. At that time, the Bennett's owned both houses. Oh, okay. I know how to do that. It was probably just for a short time. I don't know. Yeah. Well, and I heard that, yeah, the Davidson's, it probably went back, like, I don't know, when the Lipson's was built, the White House back there. Yeah. I thought there was... Oh, you think it was Deaver? Yeah. Possibly, I don't know. But that part seems like it's been a little bit. It actually makes sense. Yeah, that makes sense. It'd be interesting to see a 50-something map about how everything went back then. Because we've got some pictures of the 19... There's an 1866, which is not, it's kind of the N-56. And then the 1875 and the 89 are, you can see more detail. Okay. But then 1908 has the village and with the buildings much more articulated. I think I've seen that one. That's where the roads are all dirt and they sort of, it's, they're sort of spanning off, but the... Oh, that's a photograph. Yeah. No, I'm talking about a map. Oh, okay. That shows the outbuildings and any building that's all built. And that's what I was looking for here. It is sort of funny that whoever came along, Ebenezer Ames or whoever, when he built the Davidsons in 1820 or whenever, decided to line up the bedroom windows precisely with the windows at our house. You know, they didn't want, they didn't want to just offset it a little bit. So they're right in line with each other, which is kind of funny, but not a problem, but just funny. Don't, don't bother putting it three feet back or anything like that. Right, exactly. Right. Okay, well, thanks for a good application. Yeah, thanks for taking the time. I really appreciate the constructive comments and feedback and the problem. It's a good discussion. Great drawings, so you could actually have a discussion about it. Yeah, exactly. We did risk in that one. Yes. It was our... Oh, yeah? Well, he's an architect, so... That's right. Just lacking, but... Yeah, no, he... We depend on him. We need to require more. Better drawings. Yeah, these guys, basically, they've been a good partner so far. Yeah. Nice response. That's great. Goes to pop up. Yeah. Okay. Really appreciate your thoughts and expertise, everybody. Thanks so much. We really appreciate it. Bye-bye. All right. I'm going to sign off. Bye-bye. Bye-bye. Stay there, Seema. We're not done yet, Seema. Next. On our agenda, I just want to quickly approve the meeting minutes from the last meeting, which I'm sharing on the screen. I did not send it out. Okay. I do have a copy through, though. It was a very short meeting where we discussed the draft letter that you wrote. Yes, draft letter right there. And then we approved minutes from the prior meeting. That's all we did. And I volunteered to take minutes, which I wrote this morning. Yeah. Okay. Well, I would just not call it a letter, but a memo. Memo. Because we sent it and a memo. Yeah. I just see. I changed it live on the screen. Okay. Memo. Discussion about the memo from the HCC. Yeah, you didn't say something. Yeah. Good.
I drafted a memo. Yeah. It's in there twice. By the way, has there been any motion on the... I'm going to report on that. Okay. A little bit. Yeah. There was a select news meeting, and I took our memo thinking I would be speaking to the select board. Wait, you want to do... He wants to do the minutes first. Yes, do the minutes first. I'm sorry. So, Seema, I don't think you were at the last meeting, but Lynn was. Is that true? Okay. So, we have the attendees correct, then. Okay. Vote a 5-0-0. Okay. Do I then have a motion to approve the events? Yes. As reflected on the screen? Could I change the word letter to memo? Yes. Make the motion that we accept the minutes as written, just changing letter to memo. I'm getting the third one now. Second? Yeah. All in favor? A vote. All in favor? Gretchen, yes. Marjorie, yes. Edmund, yes. Greg, yes. Okay. Seema? Yes, but I wasn't at the meeting, so... Oh. So, you have a vote of 4-0-0. 4-0 abstention. 4-0-1. Were you in Venice?
Well, no. I was in Colombia, Panama, so a different place. But that is my painting, but that is Venice, yes. But that is my painting, so... Okay. Stop, share. Thank you. So, next on the agenda is a discussion about the memo to the select board, and thank you, Marjorie, for attending last night. Um, I was watching by Zoom, uh, John Weitraub from the board of the Historical Society was there, and my only added input at this point is the Historical Society is also very interested in this, too, because it's parking for them, anyway, and, um, but how do we want to... And his wife is a trustee at the library. Oh, really? Oh, my goodness. Yeah. That's why he knew about it. Oh, lovely. I should have given John a copy of our memo at the meeting night. Well, they have it because they... That's why they, I mean, the, um, library director, Chris Lindquist, contacted me, uh, last week and asked me to meet with him and Aida about our memo, because they were concerned about, um, anything that we want to say about parking at the library. Thank you. I learned today that Marjorie did go and was not allowed to speak, as were, but all the trustees were there. Mm-hmm. Um, and that I would have to request, I was not named on the agenda, so I would not have been able to speak, and she said, I didn't know Marjorie was coming. I said, well, I didn't know my plane was canceled, you know, until that morning, so, um, but anyway, uh, she said that it's been turned over to, well, I should let you do the rest. Well, it's, it's been, what she actually did, um, was there were so many people, it was kind of packed to speak just on that issue, that, um, she turned it over to the, um, manager, the town manager, um, and, uh, asked him, um, and basically one of the things she did say is that there, she was having a hard time, uh, confining some of the dialogue. People would get up and speak and they'd go on and on, and in order to confine out of bed, um, she brought the, she just asked the, um, town manager to describe what he had done, because he's been reaching out to all these people, and he hasn't, um, so she asked him basically, uh, she tossed the ball into his court, um, she feels that, and that what needs to happen now is that he needs to meet with these various groups and hear what they think about how the parking should be improved and expanded and the whole thing, and, um, one of the things that we had mentioned at the end of our memo, and I thought the memo was beautifully written, and it was really, it was a beautiful memo. Well, you all, we all proved it. Thank you. No, but you, we, we reworked it on our April meeting. It was not, in that form. Yeah, exactly. It was from the whole commission. Um, we had made the point at the end that there were short-term, uh, things that could be done, that could be done quite quickly. Right. And then there were the long-term, like hiring a planner or a traveler and so on. Yeah, no, right. And, uh, really kind of looking at all these parcels and pieces and coming up with an intelligent plan for that, for parking and sharing them. Um, but, um, what did happen today is, uh, the chair did give me a call. She kind of apologized for my not being allowed to speak, and she just explained a little bit why, and why she tossed it into the port of the town manager, who is going to handle it now. Right. Um, and, uh, I even got to speak, uh, I had a nice conversation with, I'm trying to remember his name now, um, Reynolds, um, Chris Reynolds, and he thought we should have had a chance to say something. So, um, I just reviewed the memo with him, and he listened to me very politely. Well, they all had the memo. They have a, yeah, they have a, I think in their packet, they have lots of memos in their packet. Oh, I know, I know. I think the need for review is, you know, good. One thing Carol said on the phone, though, uh, when we did talk briefly, um, I feel this, there's really a need for a professional to come in with planning. I mean, it's really needed. We have all these different ideas from these different groups. She said there isn't money for it right now in the budget. It needs to be budgeted. And, um, I asked about grants, or I asked about, um, because, um, you know, the rail trail's coming through, and maybe somehow we could work with DCR or MassDOT. I mean, if they have a rail trail, they'll need parking so people can use the rail trail. Right. So, um, I'm not sure if this is out of bounds, but is there, there must be, I can't imagine there's not an urban designer living in Wayland that might want to volunteer. You mean there's no one that lives in Wayland? You mean there's no one that lives in Wayland? Sorry? That lives in Wayland? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Right. That could be. I don't know anybody off the top of my head, but. But I don't know why the, uh, planning board can't, I mean, they'll know about grants. Right. I don't, I don't happen to know about them, but, you know, they're applying for grants all the time, and I think that's a good idea. And, and, or divine one voice. What I have heard, or hopefully heard from listening in, um, was our memo did the job of getting this all kicked off beautifully, and what I thought I heard, I think the town manager say was, we need to get everybody into the room, and hear, get their inputs in a collaborative meeting. I think I heard the word collaborative, which would be. That was the thing I said to Marjorie. Yeah, and that's good, and I, and I heard, uh, district commission, historical society, library, and I also heard the new owner of the new town center. That was news to me. Yeah. Um, that they might have some contributions to the discussion. Uh-huh. Yeah. Um, and I don't know who would represent the rail trail, the depot, neighbors, you, obviously. Yeah. Um, and I don't know who represents the rail trail, but how will they tell them? Tom Fain chambers the, the committee. Really? Yeah. To, you know, do the signage, do all that stuff. Farming councils, and Tom Fain met with us, remember, regarding the sign. Oh, those pieces, yeah. So, they would be the ones we would probably get. So, what, what do we do next, or are we waiting for this town manager to set up the meeting? No, I think we're waiting for this town manager to set up the meeting, and, um, so... Well, I do know that I'm not going to attend the meeting, because then they both got back to... I said, no, I'm away, and I'm, I can't meet... Mm-hmm. They had, um, I'm sorry, the director of the library and, uh, chairman of the board of trustees, um, Haida Janis, um, wanted to meet with me next week about the memo. Yeah. Why? I sent that to you. So, what do you think, based on meeting, when it's from last night's meeting, it's not you meeting... That's right. ...our committee meeting with them, it's the town manager getting all five parties together. That's right. That's right. I'm not meeting with them. Yeah. Um, and I, I did already say before the meeting that I would not meet with them alone, that I would... I mean, it's... Memo's not from me. Yeah. It's from the district commission, and they could either meet with the district commission, or we could have a, um, not form, uh, to those relief people. Yeah. Um, but after, you know, hearing what happened last night, and it's now in, in Mike's, um, court, I'm not meeting. Yeah. I agree. Yeah. I think the other very nice thing is the memo really stated our position so clearly, that really nothing else needs to be said. I even turned around and gave Aida a copy. I had some copies, so I gave her one. They had one, because that's how they... I'm sure. That's why they found out about it, and why, I guess, Chris was... Yeah. ...upset. Right. Right. Well... Yeah. Upset. Do you think upset? Uh, they, they have a parking problem, and they're so concerned that, um, if there's more parking over there, they'll have even more problems. So, so I, I bid, the parking of the library does need to be addressed. Yeah. I, I think we need a professional. Well... We're out there in some... Throughout, throughout, throughout the town needs to be addressed. Yeah. You know, that's, that's, that's, that's the way to, to think about it. But I think especially in the historic district, it needs to be. Um, but if you have parking on streets, you have people walking, you get people getting out of cars and walking about. And I just think that can't be a good thing. No, not on 27. Right. No. Or Route 20. Route 20. Oh, I think, I actually think it should happen on 20. I think it'll slow cars down and a couple of crosswalks. I mean, think about, think about, um, um, any of the town centers around us that we, we like. I mean, even the ones, even the ones that I think are, are nice, but aren't, aren't, don't, don't jump to my mind. Like a native center has parking in it on the streets. The main streets coming down. It's a very wide street. It, it, it is. Um, but it means people slow down and, um, you know, uh, the same thing with, the same thing, same thing is in, in, in, in, in, in concrete. Um, and yes, that's the nature of those, those town centers are different from ours, but I think the same principles about, about allowing for parking on roadways and getting people out of their car, actually walking on the sidewalks is a good thing. We, we do have some nice sidewalks. The thing that concerns me, uh, Desmond, is that the number of cars that take, that are on 27 is a tremendous number that come from Hudson and beyond. Yeah. I mean, people don't think about that, but they do. Right. And it, the traffic count was something like, I remember it was something like 22,000. Yeah. In a 24 hour period. Right. I mean, it's a huge number. And then the one on 20 is a little less than that. Yeah. So it's like a major highway. But I would say to you that if it takes people longer to go through that intersection, that's not a bad thing. Right. No, I agree. I agree. I think. I agree with that. Yeah. But that's just, that's just, that's kind of, we're not traffic engineers. No, but that's, that's urban design 101. It really kind of is. Yeah. And, um, and so we just, I think that just needs to be in the back of our head that, um, we're not here to ease, we're not, nobody's here to ease the speed of cars going through the town. No, no, no, no. I think, I think what our, what if, if, if, if, if we, I think it's much better to start thinking about slowing cars down as they come through the town center. Yeah. And it not being a traffic exchange, but being a town center. And then at crossroads, not a traffic stop. I guess my concern would be the safety. Yeah. More than, more than anything else. Well, that's where, that's where, that's where crosswalks. Yeah. Would, would, I mean, I've, I've a couple of times tried to, to go across, um, um, the street, um, uh, in the town, in, in, in, in, in, in the center of town and it's, you really gotta be quite careful. Yeah. It's not, it's hardly long enough to, uh, manage to get across. Cause when we did the, uh, walking tour. Yeah. Yeah. You know, we had, it took about three lights to get everybody. Yeah. So I think, I think we should be able to exert some control over the way 27 and 20 are utilized within the town. Yeah. And all the other options that we put in. Wow. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. And all the other topics, part in spots at the library behind the, uh, free notes, the free notes. Right? But they did not like that concept. Okay. So, I mean, you know, they're being protective of. of the library and we've thrown out the idea I wonder and again, Gretchen, you just said that it would be the planning board, not us they would look into grants but with the real trail being extended and even putting down a new crosswalk oh and you're going to laugh I have to cross the street tonight for the meeting in the gas company as you know right in front of my house is a small park they're moving that whole junction it's going to take two months and working at night Monday through Thursdays anyway they moved across the street they have these metal plates that you'd see that they're used on the road but it is between it's close to the road but it's between the museum and the library right exactly where the rail trail people had plans to have the crosswalk come in and to change the junction a little bit so it linked with the rail trail better but now these big plates are right there that's where the the doors are going to be for remember we had a meeting trying to encourage them to work together yes kind of you know national grid and for the bike bikes well I hope that we will be that Mike well Michael McCall the town manager will include the historic district in this group but yeah it's I mean I think we've done the best we've had and now we just have to keep our foot on the pedal yeah right so is there a motion here to record or is this discussion just discussion this is just discussion Gretchen do you think there's any chance if there's any rent relative to this as I was trying to say before the pavement the hard pavement that's going to be coming through and the rail trail do you think there's I don't know I mean I'm so I don't have any idea but the town planner should know that okay right yeah and we hope that Michael will contact him yeah or I can whisper to him yeah he really should be part of this discussion if he's going to pull everybody in it should be include our commission at the town planner yeah yes you're right and at least they have somebody but thank you for going well I'm sorry thank you for I didn't know that I should have asked to be on the agenda in person yeah as it turned out the phone conversation was worked out well but it was just the selectman they didn't let the library do you think no no the library nobody spoke the ball was talked right over to the town manager Michael do I have a motion to adjourn the new thing I guess you do so moving second second thank you all in favor all in favor you know what is great this is a well-run meeting Gretchen yes Gretchen yes Gretchen yes Sima yes Sima yes Sima yes okay well call Sima thank you we have a great but I guess we won't go we'll talk about that thank you no your thanks I'll talk about that everything again it's in the screen see what I've been doing
we hope we hope that we will vote whether or no perfect sounds good yeah thanks for the opportunity to come in steve and um your your last but probably most important on our list of wayland visits we've got all the other permits um uh in terms of conservation community uh uh building permits and process and uh zba so we're here to to talk about the structure and what our plans are so i'll walk through it real quick and let me know it um and if you want to stop and get into any details but i've got some drawings we can look at um my wife mary's on the phone um so thanks for uh having the virtual connection too so let's surely jump in and plug in any details i guess because i'm sure there will be so um we're discussing a barn on the property at 30 coach and um it's uh we're taking the approach of a a new structure with um a traditional look so it's going to be a traditional post and being barn two stories um i'll talk about the dimensions a little bit more in a bit but it's 24 by 38 um and 22 feet tall with a cupola on top and uh we went with a particular company country carpenters out of connecticut who specializes in post and being barns and um really to maintain the aesthetic um and to keep it consistent with one that the other i guess relative um barns in the area uh the structures in the area and also with the house and um our properties according to youtube um so a little bit around uh the history of the law is i've got some drawings here if you want to pass this round it's in the application but it's a little bit um small so it's hard to see this is the uh um lot itself you can see it's long and narrow non-conforming the red is where the barn is in the house is just to your left as you're looking at it up the side a little bit so um we we have a we know it's a non-conforming lot because actually part of our house is on our neighbor's property which is very interesting for our house was 1818 theirs was 1823 and we know that a quarter of the line was ripped to the corner house which is interesting so when we were looking at positioning um we had a couple options but not many and we decided to put on that side of the property line which stands between our property and the attorney building so it gives a little bit of privacy but still maintains the yard and the openness and access to the yard um and we have the davidson's on the left-hand side and the libsine's behind uh and they both submitted um letters of support for this so um you know it's i guess uh functionally it's achieving a few things one is that level privacy two is the garage um and three is the aesthetic um it's mainly going to be you you know your typical sort of barn um i guess utility area storage and workspace uh it's not going to be livable space um it's two stories there is access uh a fixed stairway out to the second floor but we're going to maintain it unfinished for now so we'll have an insulated pad on the bottom in case we ever want to come back and do more but for now it's just going to be storage there will be electrical service to it um for lights and brush drawers and hopefully they're good fun stuff and no heating uh no heating immediately we were contemplating um maybe putting some under slab heating in just to keep the floor moving to work on the cars and stuff but uh we're not going to insulate the walls right away so maybe in the future um and i think part of part of the reason that you know we were keen on this design is when we bought the house uh i guess we've lived there for about 13 years we understood that there was somebody that was trying to um buy to convert it to some sort of commercial um uh i guess property and we think that this will add some character and keep it residential for a long term so it's another kind of thing um you mentioned how people's face the parcel layout um you know i think that the other the other good thing about the placement on the property before i get to design is um with that placement there is um uh a privacy fence there right now that we put up years ago that'll have to come down temporarily our plan is to take that down we need to reduce some trees um and the barn erupted and put the fence back up but placement there actually maintains the existing curb cut so we don't have to add any driveway space it's sort of a branch naturally off our existing driveway um and um once we put the fence and the farm back up we're going to do some landscaping around it it's really the best placement between us or neighbors thank you you wouldn't have to put the fence back immediately adjacent to it would you we don't have to but um we have a dog yeah part of it is you know we want to maintain yeah the closure of the yard um and uh we will have to take more than we need down temporarily just so they can make sure that you know they have access to one do the foundation or the structure up um so it's we're going to take probably two-thirds of the fence down right we'll be the space between the fence and behind um right now we envision probably about three feet yeah yeah yeah okay so um does that mean you're going to um widen the pituitous concrete um in front of blue arm because you've got two doors so you'll have to widen the drive yeah we think we'll have to widen the driveway a little bit so there's a turnout off the drive i don't know it's clear in there but yeah it's a little bit wider than that turnout yeah yeah we're trying to figure out if we you know if we what we do with that if we pave to the width of the barn or add some or start or something or something yeah yeah so it'll have to but to do something there right this is slightly wider yeah i just recently used what do they call it processed stone is that right is that the right word i don't know but anyway what it is it it binds together very well they use it usually for foundational things and um for our my driveway anyway can get you know uh you can have lumps and bumps and that kind of it has worked out very well the other thing that uh i've loved over at my place is to be able to use or know when it's raining and have their garage doors open and i'm going in the snow or whatever and sometimes what we've done here at the commission if you want to go one way or another okay and you think you might choose to go another way in the future for instance with doors that open and close with a remote sometimes we can approve one or the other okay you know depending on yeah we do envision there'll be there'll be automatic doors they'll have lifts on them so that's what we envisioned so we want to make sure they open um and i've got some pictures uh in the back and we get to that stage to show um what the at least it didn't look that way to me it looked like they look like it but they looked up oh all right thank you good for explaining good that's wonderful but yeah but the driveway is interesting it would be nice i think we're trying to minimize disruption to the existing driveway if we can but realize it might get beat up during construction uh it will be yeah they start to do it will happen when we went to conservation we do have to do some drainage work um and we they're going to have to dig the foundation so we'll probably have to relay some of that right so you wouldn't go with crushed stone would you instead of petuminous we we consider it i think um the existing driveway is asphalt or it's paper yeah yeah yeah right now so we'd probably try to match that if we could um but right now there's a width it's about two and a half or three feet that we'd have to extend it out right so that may be one or the other yeah hopefully brilliant just reduces water runoff that's all that's a good point definitely and you are in the pipeline no no no but we did get a conservation um permit uh because i was just curious what they said about the surface yeah no they they we presented the drainage plan to them uh and they were fine with it um i think that it is it's a bit of a when we talk about heights um the barn is it's going to be 22 feet with a with a cupola but it does sit lower than the house so the house is 29 feet but it's on back point of property that area it is a little bit low um so we had to go for the drainage plan right there's there's some water boiling it's not significant but yeah it gets mushy here yeah
um let's see the you know i talked about the consistency we envision uh so it's it's going to be um the exterior is going to be shiplap asphalt shingles on the roof um with the cupola we've got a color that i think we updated actually i'll mention that but it's going to be deep red more or less consistent with the color of the depot um yeah that's you know traditional barn color uh and then all the the fixtures um windows will be in the wood um and you can see we're planning on doing some window boxes and some sliding doors to give it the you know the barn uh and what color will the will the windows and the trim be uh we're right now we're going with all deep red okay okay sure um so a few pictures in the application just to show sort of where it falls um you can see this is the existing driveway and i share it here every time i have to scrape ice off my cars so um but sort of coming in and going around to the right it was a certain area you can see from the road um behind the basketball hoop yeah so we do have to take down some of these trees that we're planning and replanning eventually um they're an old way we're both so they're invasive anyway but yeah yeah i'm telling mary that really that is a southern exposure and anything will grow very well our variety would grow fabulously yeah in fact we have a very large everybody there now that we're going to try to relocate temperance on the other side of the fence it grows like crazy yeah um and actually another another good thing about the fence is we get a lot of salt they plow that road and oh yes salt it constantly right that's the playstation so on the outside not many things do very well
are you going to talk about the turret all right yes yeah so um yeah in the last page i've got some dimensions um so we want to present a little bit of colors too so this is the general style it's it's it's going to look like this um but the front will be a little bit different like two garage doors um sorry was there a question oh i'm sorry i was just coughing my apologies okay it's okay sorry for those on the phone that can't see all the diagrams but um it'll be very similar to this um with two garage doors on the side and then i've got the pictures here for um the you know the different sides so this is the side facing the yard this would be the back facing the inviting neighbors um and yeah um kind of a board not a um facing the road and this is yeah what would you call the boards ship what just ship ship yeah ship yeah lap time like your ship lap board okay so this is the uh side facing the yard and then the back roomers and this will be a good privacy event so this is sort of nowhere broodlands here and this is uh it's a critical board i call ship back there oh yeah did i say because that's the way ships are built it's better called ship yes yeah oh maybe something
yeah what would you call that yeah yeah yeah yeah then um so everything's it's you can see in the engineering drawings it's all close to me yeah with the it's all white pine that they source um and then the outside will get a stain we did make a change to the color originally we we mentioned in the application carriage red but i think we've gone with um a deeper barn red stain yeah the steam is what i use this person yeah this will be used and we'll see about the shadows yeah well we just found it works so much better than the paint well it does except for the fact that it breaks down back to ultraviolet yeah and the shadows will be the same the shadows will be that the dark asphalt yeah
just wanted to ask is the is it a standalone by itself or is it going to be yes yes standalone any um any gutters on the building no no gutters um we we don't have gutters in our house so we want to keep the look similar um but we will be doing french drains along the side and then um probably a drywall somewhere we are too to different right and then what we anticipate on um i guess on the inside so i'll probably go to the inside one other question about the the doors so okay can we go back to the front elevation um so i'm not actually does the door pop this way it doesn't fold because i don't see any lines showing here yeah this this might be a little bit tough that's just in the drawing i guess one of these um just curious look i don't even know if we uh it's going to look similar to this but it is intended to lift up yeah um but yeah there's you know i just don't see the lines that's right you know she went to drawings oh no i'm actually following the picture through the website i went to the google and google's showing me the your house so i can see it so i imagine but it is going to it's going to so this position yeah it's going to be a couple blocks here that i'm showing here yeah they didn't draw them in okay
okay so seema's looking at a google map of the lot and so i think we just have to explain to her exactly where the position is yeah i i'm imagining it's i think you explained it just now you said it's on it's facing millbrook if i'm not mistaken am i correct yeah it's not facing it but one of the long signs and it's uh behind the uh your basketball uh poop that you have right now i can see that so can you imagine if you're looking at the basketball hoop you'll see the two front garage doors at the barnabill straight back from there so it's on there yeah that's like the tables right is that operable it will be um it'll open yeah i don't know what we'll do with it yeah it sort it just looks cool yeah look at here and they were out yeah so desmond's asking about the um the um uh hey door above the uh garage doors and yes it is operable yeah i think part of it part of the we talked about you know two windows or something different i like this windows on the dormer side and we just thought that was a little more sure i don't know it makes sense the proportions are good on this itself actually i think same i just emailed you the pdf if you don't have it yeah thank you
can the heat the air go up into the cooler or no i don't i don't think it'll be vented at all but there is going to be a light up there um okay but i don't think it's going to be open i think it's more decorative yeah but and actually there was a uh an error in the application so i think the application said it's three feet cool but it's actually six feet so it'll sit about five feet above right yeah hi everyone i'm sorry can you hear me this is mary yeah yeah we hear you hi everyone i don't know if everyone was aware i was online i'm sorry that um i'm not there in person i my mom had a surgery so i'm um helping her at her house but um i just want to the the cupola doesn't actually have a light in it it is it's just decorative and it it doesn't have a light i just want to clarify that oh thanks mary sorry sorry
i'm i'm really bad at this and so i depend upon desmond uh the proportions i think the portions are quite nice yeah i think they are yeah because i mean that was a discussion i had with mary when yeah this is right i'm assuming much the score of this i think this proportion yeah yeah there was that one when we looked at a shorter one that was yeah three feet inside yeah but it quite looked right yeah this is nice what's the uh what is the wood here it's it's gonna be painted like this area here yeah it's gonna be painted red to match yeah the body of it that's the intention i don't i think that's this i don't know mary if you know the the wood around the base of the cupola is that the same as this siding or i believe they make everything out of eastern white pine at country carpenters yes yeah yeah they just they've oriented they've oriented the the the timbers and they yeah 49 degrees too like they are showing down here i think you'd want to have it red yeah you would you know the dark with the uh yeah uh as well i mean this is this shows up as well yeah right that's my assumption uh i'm looking at your uh the benton model are you following the same window um grid like the the the kind of like the structure that that you have here with the window box is that how you're doing the same windows
yes the window we're gonna put um do window boxes but the um the muntins and and mary maybe you want to jump in here around colors on the because i think one of these pictures shows white but and it shows a um a 12 by and i i think we're slightly different right right i couldn't i couldn't find a specific image that shows exactly our configuration but um and the window boxes actually did end up getting moved to the rear of the barn on facing our backyard because those side doors that we have on it on the long side of it are going to open and they would have bumped into the window boxes um but those wouldn't have been visible from the road anyway so um regarding the windows though we have two small six light windows i believe next to the sliding doors on the what would be the north side and then um to i believe there are 12 lights on the south side and then um two additional windows uh on the rear facing like the lipson's the east end and i think that's pretty much it oh there's one 12 light window in the second floor facing the um facing the east so facing the lipson's property um which would illuminate the you know the the loft area and the loft area also does have that dormer facing the north so it won't be too visible from the road you might see a little bit of the outline you know when you're face when you're facing the front of the garage doors and that has three windows in it my um a bit of practicalness um i like light in the garage and particular garage the doors have windows so i get windows i get it's in the door whereas this picture right here shows a little transom of windows um and i'm just more likely to win in the better it's a trade-off of privacy yeah um but the one above the garage door people can't really see in that one yeah at all but yeah we talked about transoms and then i guess the um you know a couple of things there's sliding doors on the side um this will open right up into the area too so that is one way we can get light in without sort of opening ourselves up yeah um we're on such a main thoroughfare you know we we're trying we always try to at least limit um yeah i think it's a good point to let some light in without visibility yeah when we're in the driveway open the doors it's this side faces the yard yeah yeah and then yeah what we envision is off of this we want to probably put a little bit of a patio down and make it sort of a sitting space yeah you know um the other thing i would throw out my barn it's very very hot and very very cold uh but um i've always been intrigued with the um cupless you know to let the heat out and because you know with a fan or with anything else it could just just natural venting yeah just natural venting as well yes it's just natural venting the heat rises it kind of goes out you open the doors down on the first floor and the air flows right up and you know out um but but if it's just meant to be decorative maybe there's no way to let that happen yeah i don't know how we would do that but we do know so we did these windows will open on the top um so that's why we wanted to at least have you know a couple of sets and some areas for cross breeze so they look at that too yeah okay yeah is it standard practice to put a vapor barrier under the garage slab the concrete slab yeah we're going to insulate um under the garage slab yeah and he wants to do that okay yeah i think mine was not and i can't paint it because of that oh really i see moisture coming yeah yeah yeah you want to be prepared yeah yeah good yeah we're going to insulate and we are we are talking about running some um uh some conduit for the slab to um i don't know if we'll do that right away but we at least want to set it up so so essentially to heat a slab you know there's there's a couple ways to do it but the best way to do it is the tubing is put in and the concrete is poured the tubing is in situ um so yeah you kind of need to do it now or you don't yeah yeah yeah our plan is to at least route it i think um the other thing we're contemplating is what's going on the inside because it might put a car lift in there so we're rolling around the lift and yeah yeah yeah but to be clear the the insulation will just be for working on the cars we're not i want to be clear on the record that we're not making it habitable space so just to make sure not bad um just just to be aware that you know you you need to put the you need to put the lines in the concrete when you're pouring otherwise otherwise it's too late yeah yeah yeah unless you put a floor above over the concrete yeah you can do it that way if you if you put like a wood floor if you wanted to over the concrete you can route the bottom the underside of the of the of the of the uh the wood and put they use rubber hoses like if you put a floating floor you can then put it in but what it's not doing is it's not getting the the so what you really want is you want to be able to you're heating the slab and the slab heats the air right that's what you want and the slab then retains the heat for a long period of time because it's concrete but if you if you are just heating on the surface it doesn't quite it's not quite as efficient that's all that's just something to know yeah yeah and after uh a long time of laying on old on hard cold concrete i think it'd be nice to have something i'm rooting for you but yeah i think um it's foundationally you probably know the steps better than us but yeah the putters have to go in first and then the slab so we have a little bit of time to figure out what that heating right looks like but that that would be intended at least yeah
um it's really nice so what's the structure behind the that's going to be behind the bar is there like a small shed back there yeah there's a small shed back there now that'll stay yeah um and actually the color is going to be very similar to the final piece okay yeah when do you hope to start very soon uh we're hoping so that the kit will probably be done later this summer and then trying to figure out yeah like i said we've got some tree work we need to do we have to do ground a ton of ground prep um so i think it all depends on um you know how quickly we can once we once we get through here if you guys issue the the certificate of appropriateness we have to get the billing permit that's the last step and then we'll get to it so hopefully this summer that's the intent and there are no there are no um setback requirements uh between the structure the new structure and the the fence um there's yeah there's everything's non-conforming oh okay
okay sorry funny the only conforming place to put it would have been smack dab in the middle of the so that's okay um back to the transom light you're not going to put transoms over the yard shores we're not planning on it no no can i speak to that first we i originally had sort of just steered away from those because in my mind i thought they weren't as historic looking um or or historically accurate but i like the look of them would you guys approve of those do you because we are i was concerned about getting um enough natural light in the barn but the we kind of wanted to go with what looked the most traditional and the most in line with the house but i i like the look of transoms um do you think they are appropriate for that type of structure yeah i mean since then since we purchased it without them i've seen many examples of really old barns with transoms so i wasn't sure well i don't think they did them in the 18th century but i mean our park that's in the blue barn you know you've got dressing lights yeah on the um cable and the bar and what we could do is you could go either either way you know from us as we consider that yeah yeah and even with the paint i mean you've talked about staying but maybe you'll change your mind decide you'd rather use paint so sometimes it's better to uh have the options on the table okay that's that's i'm glad you mentioned the transoms because um the natural light is an issue and we had um you know looked into carriage style garage doors but country carpenters doesn't offer those and it started to become kind of just you know cumbersome to to get another company to come in and and do them and we like the look of the um the plain country carpenters ones you know very traditional but definitely dark inside so we just thought we'd add a lot of light bulbs yeah do you have the ceiling clearance for that right above that do we those two doors um yeah actually uh we are we're the foundational work we're going to boost some what are the dimensions where do you know what it's going to come up i think we're we're adding 18 inches to the frost walls they're usually uh i can't remember what exactly is it 24 above grade and we're adding them we're making them um 30 30 i don't know we're adding 18 inches to the frost walls um in order to get additional ceiling height for the first floor for a car lift so it's still it doesn't it still doesn't add too much to the height and also because it's the lowest part of the yard hopefully it will still kind of look nestled in there but it is a little bit we added to the first floor height by increasing the height of the frost wall and if you recall my um garage that goes between the joists um and stuff that's yeah well i think my sorry i've been close to you i think yeah the lift lift is going to take some creativity because the way the posted beams or on the inside the way the beams come up they've got some angled pieces yeah so we have to figure that out and we have to be a like a scissor lift that sits flushing the floor that goes on another practical tip and you're welcome to i'm looking at modeling where you put them in the depth wise in the garage makes a big difference of getting out of your car and you're not using the lift right so i put mine way forward so i can park the car use it without banging the lift but when i want to use a lift i go another five feet forward yeah that's what we're looking back because that was what i was grappling with too is yeah you can't really park in between it full time no because you just don't have the clearance on the side side so there's this is just really nitpicking um why is there um an arch on or why is the window in the cupola with a mini a segmental large oh right above it that's the cupola window the cupola or the art there's another sky right here oh is that one right there yeah it's a vent is that a vent there's a vent right over the door is that what you're talking about or are you talking yes i think that's i actually i kind of love getting into this level of detail i'm totally with you on uh you know getting it right we chose they have you know five or six types you can choose from and i think we chose one but we're totally open to a different style uh you know like say one with just wooden vents or something like that because it is it is decorative unfortunately not functional um and i believe there is if you really were interested there's a a page on the country carpenter's um website that shows what they are um you know what they offer for um for cupolas so um that one it has the arch in the window just simply because that's their offering um and so i'm sending brian at the the page in case anyone wants to see what other ones they offer in case there was a different yeah there's a couple of pictures here that show the slatted vents versus the uh ones with windows well um it's not going to be open to the uh garage no no no it's okay all right yeah so
so then it doesn't matter whether it's a window or event in terms of function yeah uh i think in the large style but in the large style they offer a louver instead of a window but that also has an arch at the top and i think those are the only our only choices in the large version where the windows or the the vents and both have that little arch over over so i'm not sure um you know what would be preferred put a weather vane we talked about it they offer a pig in the course
um but i don't i don't i don't know if we've we didn't draw we draw a weather down there right there yeah we haven't purchased a weather vane yet um but i think we'd like to put one on if that would be uh acceptable um we might we can come back and get that approved separately if that's um something that would be fall under our certificate issue because i don't think we have it chosen yet
or we could just stick it on there scowcart weather vane came from the house the barn a block away that's right right it's in the shelburne museum that's right but the car top oh yeah yeah yeah mcwayland is home with weather games oh okay
well i guess i probably would you be getting to say what i um prefer but i don't think that's but the other is not inappropriate so it would be i think that as marjorie has said that in terms of the um louvered or windowed cupola that perhaps we should let you decide either is one letter either would be fine yeah the one the one thing that uh you did you did point out which i think is true is that um if it's open um does it appear like the glazed cupola they're showing in that photograph for the open cupola which you can just see through it yeah um versus it having louvers and being a bit more volumetric that's all and that's that's just a personal choice i believe that's what it is yeah that's a good point i don't know if we back i don't remember seeing those in person unless you do merit i think it's clear glass but yeah the louvers might just add a little bit more um a little bit more texture a little bit more you know
you we're talking about having a light up there at one point yeah i mentioned it but i think that might be an option yeah and uh it seems to me that to have a light up there could be a good option and to louver it would be a good option yeah i really think it just comes down to a personal choice about whether there's a louver or not it would be hard to say that any of them are inappropriate right that's really all we can't say oh i like that so do it right we have to say whether it's appropriate uh but yeah i appreciate that back to it i think i think it's a good point yeah especially this and just the aesthetic right yeah well i mean but you all do have uh you know knowledge of historical aesthetic and you know accuracy things so we're happy to um hear your opinions honestly uh you know i i kind of don't i don't have a strong opinion about the cupola actually i like having one um yeah but beyond that i don't care so gretchen what would your preference be well i mean i guess the way this is done i i guess i should go on the website and have a good look um but we're not going to hold this up for that um the it doesn't look like it's quite bulky enough well that's what that's why the way the glass is yeah is um yeah because you can see all the way through to the next side and so it just feel like the corner parts need to be a little bit bolder um in which case the way to you know deal with that is to go with the louver because it would it wouldn't be as noticeable right i wouldn't just i wouldn't disagree with what you said at all um and the other the other side of the ledger is just an actual like coming through it that's all yeah yeah that's one because it's relatively that's a bit easier doesn't it yeah yes right okay okay
i guess it's just that um with the glass the way they've done it and the narrowness of the corner post yeah um it's almost looks like it has a hat okay you know it's just yeah sort of put up there yeah and not i see that that's not part of the yeah the proportions are just a little bit too yeah but i don't think anybody would drive by and say oh my god i think that's it um yeah yeah i think that's it is there anything i missed there that we've talked through we talked about dimensions color yeah i don't i don't think so um yeah i would think we were clear that um yeah the attention is to do sort of the color drenched everything with the same color including the muntins and the garage doors and and every aspect of it so um you know no white trim or anything like that in this case so i think i think you've covered it i think that's a big choice back back back to the cupola cupola roof is copper or no it's single now yeah and i personally love the copper and not plastic copper but yeah yeah yeah yeah the fire station across the street has a giant cupola because it's a fire station or not they've got some sort of structure up there don't they yeah it's more like a tower yeah it's very large well you know it's interesting if you end up with uh with a weather vane it's a copper weather vane i think use your copper thank you yeah it would be nice to put something up there just to finish it off at some point uh so what anything that we would uh when we do finally uh do the wording for the we would uh give the option of louvered or windows yes we give the option of transoms or not over the garage doors and but we also put into the language um the option of paint or stain yes yeah option of uh greenwood windows i don't know that we yeah i mean that's uh for sure and i think that's just not something that right we can supposedly deal with color you know how i all how i feel about that i think their options are great yeah i think so too which just i just thought of something um so i should have asked before it it shows some some hinges or or or um iron mongering on the exterior of the of the yeah so is that also going to be painted red no i don't think we intended to paint that um but i guess maybe we didn't talk about that those are just black iron okay yeah good okay so the hinges are black iron yeah okay good yeah country carpenters apparently has some kind of vaguely traditional blacksmith shop you know they actually make those iron hinges on site so um they're you know relatively traditional hand forged allegedly hopefully yeah long enough sometimes they really chins on them but these work yeah decent with money um yeah yeah actually maybe maybe one more option that we have talked about um is so there's the hay bale is this called a hay bale door above the garage doors yeah hello yeah hello we have talked about maybe adding a the ridge line extension i believe you know uh one of those i don't know yeah the yeah yeah that's meant to look like it's pulling the hay up we would um sort of like to add one of those if um if that's you know just everything to make it look more barn-esque you know right as long as it has 2 000 pound capacity for machinery right right and if it happens to get used to lift up something heavy then you know that's just a bonus yeah i think there was one on one of the example photos in the application and i that's what they hadn't added it on ours but i um i liked the effect of that yeah so i agree you can add that if you like yeah um the poll a barn hoist okay i'm calling it a mountain pole okay uh hey hey hey hoist lots of lots of terms lots of terms yeah lots of terms yeah
that's been exciting yeah yeah it's been a long time coming i think we've talked about it we've lived in the house for 13 years i think we've probably talked about it for 10. okay there you go that's fine but you went away for a couple years so yeah yeah it was a job and every time i scrape cars on i think yeah every morning you scrape cars no frost no frost yes oh oh oh oh you garage your cars so therefore you know maybe you know paid into that no no no no no i would like to um move this along we do not have any public participants outside of the people here right now so do i have a motion to close the public hearing is there anybody else from the public that would like to address the commission hearing no we have a motion to close the public hearing motion to close public hearing okay second second all those in favor say aye aye aye aye we have to do a roll call because that's waiting on sima yes hi close the public hearing yes aye okay scratching left hi there's my line yeah well do i have a motion to consider for this application so moved with no with options we have to word yes exactly um i move that the um issue of certificate of appropriateness uh for a um construction of a barn um at uh 30 conchitua road and um as presented with the following options transom lights or no one um cupola louvered or windowed um
louvered or windowed okay do you want to do the paint i was going to say we should say um um option for um stain or stain or paint stain or paint in the same color range that was presented yeah they've been looking at the people and the other barns right stain or pain um i guess i should say stain or pain and red but they get it and um the addition of the uh hay hook or a oh yes
and you're calling it a hang hook huh oh it's called a hay voice uh uh i think that's it i think so does that make sense yeah i think those are before i come in does that make sense it does that's great thanks guys for that flexibility we appreciate that
um and uh should we say that the weather vane did have to come back for later then I guess that moment. I don't think it's a huge burden. It's just a matter of, well, you tell me whether you think it's much of a burden. I guess the size does matter. Yeah. And so the proportion of the weather in the issue, either we don't know. Yeah.
I'm sure it'll be a little too small, but I'm sure it'll be. Yeah, I'm sure it'll be one. Okay. All right, so that's a motion. Okay. And second. Second the motion. Second the motion. Okay, this is Gretchen. All those in favor of the motion say aye. Gretchen, aye. Gretchen, Marjorie, aye. Desmond, aye. FEMA, aye. Greg, aye.
Second, Desmond. And roll call vote. Roll call vote unanimous. Yes. Great. Thank you, Mary. All right. This'll be great. It really has been very nice. Thank you so much. Oh, you're welcome. I appreciate the feedback, too, and the thoughts. Yeah. Tomorrow, I will issue the certificate. I'd like to put the purpose of my show on PDF. And that's what we do, too, and I'm probably crossing with the manager's office. Great. Okay. I seriously doubt that there is a 20-day field period. Yeah. I mean, just want to feel it, right? Yeah. It's highly up there. So, it's highly up there. Yes. Good. Yeah, I guess the only, I mean, we wouldn't, we got letters from both our neighbors. Yeah. And I will tell you that the tiny little bit of the Davidson's house is on a historical society property. Oh, really? Oh, that's funny. Oh, that's funny. Yeah. It's funny how, like, yeah, 200 years ago, they were all right on top of each other thing and all that space. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And when I was looking up for Mary to try and figure out whether there had been a structure on the property, I could only see the 1908 map in terms of the detail. At that time, the Bennett's owned both houses. Oh, okay. I know how to do that. It was probably just for a short time. I don't know. Yeah. Well, and I heard that, yeah, the Davidson's, it probably went back, like, I don't know, when the Lipson's was built, the White House back there. Yeah. I thought there was... Oh, you think it was Deaver? Yeah. Possibly, I don't know. But that part seems like it's been a little bit. It actually makes sense. Yeah, that makes sense. It'd be interesting to see a 50-something map about how everything went back then. Because we've got some pictures of the 19... There's an 1866, which is not, it's kind of the N-56. And then the 1875 and the 89 are, you can see more detail. Okay. But then 1908 has the village and with the buildings much more articulated. I think I've seen that one. That's where the roads are all dirt and they sort of, it's, they're sort of spanning off, but the... Oh, that's a photograph. Yeah. No, I'm talking about a map. Oh, okay. That shows the outbuildings and any building that's all built. And that's what I was looking for here. It is sort of funny that whoever came along, Ebenezer Ames or whoever, when he built the Davidsons in 1820 or whenever, decided to line up the bedroom windows precisely with the windows at our house. You know, they didn't want, they didn't want to just offset it a little bit. So they're right in line with each other, which is kind of funny, but not a problem, but just funny. Don't, don't bother putting it three feet back or anything like that. Right, exactly. Right. Okay, well, thanks for a good application. Yeah, thanks for taking the time. I really appreciate the constructive comments and feedback and the problem. It's a good discussion. Great drawings, so you could actually have a discussion about it. Yeah, exactly. We did risk in that one. Yes. It was our... Oh, yeah? Well, he's an architect, so... That's right. Just lacking, but... Yeah, no, he... We depend on him. We need to require more. Better drawings. Yeah, these guys, basically, they've been a good partner so far. Yeah. Nice response. That's great. Goes to pop up. Yeah. Okay. Really appreciate your thoughts and expertise, everybody. Thanks so much. We really appreciate it. Bye-bye. All right. I'm going to sign off. Bye-bye. Bye-bye. Stay there, Seema. We're not done yet, Seema. Next. On our agenda, I just want to quickly approve the meeting minutes from the last meeting, which I'm sharing on the screen. I did not send it out. Okay. I do have a copy through, though. It was a very short meeting where we discussed the draft letter that you wrote. Yes, draft letter right there. And then we approved minutes from the prior meeting. That's all we did. And I volunteered to take minutes, which I wrote this morning. Yeah. Okay. Well, I would just not call it a letter, but a memo. Memo. Because we sent it and a memo. Yeah. I just see. I changed it live on the screen. Okay. Memo. Discussion about the memo from the HCC. Yeah, you didn't say something. Yeah. Good.
I drafted a memo. Yeah. It's in there twice. By the way, has there been any motion on the... I'm going to report on that. Okay. A little bit. Yeah. There was a select news meeting, and I took our memo thinking I would be speaking to the select board. Wait, you want to do... He wants to do the minutes first. Yes, do the minutes first. I'm sorry. So, Seema, I don't think you were at the last meeting, but Lynn was. Is that true? Okay. So, we have the attendees correct, then. Okay. Vote a 5-0-0. Okay. Do I then have a motion to approve the events? Yes. As reflected on the screen? Could I change the word letter to memo? Yes. Make the motion that we accept the minutes as written, just changing letter to memo. I'm getting the third one now. Second? Yeah. All in favor? A vote. All in favor? Gretchen, yes. Marjorie, yes. Edmund, yes. Greg, yes. Okay. Seema? Yes, but I wasn't at the meeting, so... Oh. So, you have a vote of 4-0-0. 4-0 abstention. 4-0-1. Were you in Venice?
Well, no. I was in Colombia, Panama, so a different place. But that is my painting, but that is Venice, yes. But that is my painting, so... Okay. Stop, share. Thank you. So, next on the agenda is a discussion about the memo to the select board, and thank you, Marjorie, for attending last night. Um, I was watching by Zoom, uh, John Weitraub from the board of the Historical Society was there, and my only added input at this point is the Historical Society is also very interested in this, too, because it's parking for them, anyway, and, um, but how do we want to... And his wife is a trustee at the library. Oh, really? Oh, my goodness. Yeah. That's why he knew about it. Oh, lovely. I should have given John a copy of our memo at the meeting night. Well, they have it because they... That's why they, I mean, the, um, library director, Chris Lindquist, contacted me, uh, last week and asked me to meet with him and Aida about our memo, because they were concerned about, um, anything that we want to say about parking at the library. Thank you. I learned today that Marjorie did go and was not allowed to speak, as were, but all the trustees were there. Mm-hmm. Um, and that I would have to request, I was not named on the agenda, so I would not have been able to speak, and she said, I didn't know Marjorie was coming. I said, well, I didn't know my plane was canceled, you know, until that morning, so, um, but anyway, uh, she said that it's been turned over to, well, I should let you do the rest. Well, it's, it's been, what she actually did, um, was there were so many people, it was kind of packed to speak just on that issue, that, um, she turned it over to the, um, manager, the town manager, um, and, uh, asked him, um, and basically one of the things she did say is that there, she was having a hard time, uh, confining some of the dialogue. People would get up and speak and they'd go on and on, and in order to confine out of bed, um, she brought the, she just asked the, um, town manager to describe what he had done, because he's been reaching out to all these people, and he hasn't, um, so she asked him basically, uh, she tossed the ball into his court, um, she feels that, and that what needs to happen now is that he needs to meet with these various groups and hear what they think about how the parking should be improved and expanded and the whole thing, and, um, one of the things that we had mentioned at the end of our memo, and I thought the memo was beautifully written, and it was really, it was a beautiful memo. Well, you all, we all proved it. Thank you. No, but you, we, we reworked it on our April meeting. It was not, in that form. Yeah, exactly. It was from the whole commission. Um, we had made the point at the end that there were short-term, uh, things that could be done, that could be done quite quickly. Right. And then there were the long-term, like hiring a planner or a traveler and so on. Yeah, no, right. And, uh, really kind of looking at all these parcels and pieces and coming up with an intelligent plan for that, for parking and sharing them. Um, but, um, what did happen today is, uh, the chair did give me a call. She kind of apologized for my not being allowed to speak, and she just explained a little bit why, and why she tossed it into the port of the town manager, who is going to handle it now. Right. Um, and, uh, I even got to speak, uh, I had a nice conversation with, I'm trying to remember his name now, um, Reynolds, um, Chris Reynolds, and he thought we should have had a chance to say something. So, um, I just reviewed the memo with him, and he listened to me very politely. Well, they all had the memo. They have a, yeah, they have a, I think in their packet, they have lots of memos in their packet. Oh, I know, I know. I think the need for review is, you know, good. One thing Carol said on the phone, though, uh, when we did talk briefly, um, I feel this, there's really a need for a professional to come in with planning. I mean, it's really needed. We have all these different ideas from these different groups. She said there isn't money for it right now in the budget. It needs to be budgeted. And, um, I asked about grants, or I asked about, um, because, um, you know, the rail trail's coming through, and maybe somehow we could work with DCR or MassDOT. I mean, if they have a rail trail, they'll need parking so people can use the rail trail. Right. So, um, I'm not sure if this is out of bounds, but is there, there must be, I can't imagine there's not an urban designer living in Wayland that might want to volunteer. You mean there's no one that lives in Wayland? You mean there's no one that lives in Wayland? Sorry? That lives in Wayland? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Right. That could be. I don't know anybody off the top of my head, but. But I don't know why the, uh, planning board can't, I mean, they'll know about grants. Right. I don't, I don't happen to know about them, but, you know, they're applying for grants all the time, and I think that's a good idea. And, and, or divine one voice. What I have heard, or hopefully heard from listening in, um, was our memo did the job of getting this all kicked off beautifully, and what I thought I heard, I think the town manager say was, we need to get everybody into the room, and hear, get their inputs in a collaborative meeting. I think I heard the word collaborative, which would be. That was the thing I said to Marjorie. Yeah, and that's good, and I, and I heard, uh, district commission, historical society, library, and I also heard the new owner of the new town center. That was news to me. Yeah. Um, that they might have some contributions to the discussion. Uh-huh. Yeah. Um, and I don't know who would represent the rail trail, the depot, neighbors, you, obviously. Yeah. Um, and I don't know who represents the rail trail, but how will they tell them? Tom Fain chambers the, the committee. Really? Yeah. To, you know, do the signage, do all that stuff. Farming councils, and Tom Fain met with us, remember, regarding the sign. Oh, those pieces, yeah. So, they would be the ones we would probably get. So, what, what do we do next, or are we waiting for this town manager to set up the meeting? No, I think we're waiting for this town manager to set up the meeting, and, um, so... Well, I do know that I'm not going to attend the meeting, because then they both got back to... I said, no, I'm away, and I'm, I can't meet... Mm-hmm. They had, um, I'm sorry, the director of the library and, uh, chairman of the board of trustees, um, Haida Janis, um, wanted to meet with me next week about the memo. Yeah. Why? I sent that to you. So, what do you think, based on meeting, when it's from last night's meeting, it's not you meeting... That's right. ...our committee meeting with them, it's the town manager getting all five parties together. That's right. That's right. I'm not meeting with them. Yeah. Um, and I, I did already say before the meeting that I would not meet with them alone, that I would... I mean, it's... Memo's not from me. Yeah. It's from the district commission, and they could either meet with the district commission, or we could have a, um, not form, uh, to those relief people. Yeah. Um, but after, you know, hearing what happened last night, and it's now in, in Mike's, um, court, I'm not meeting. Yeah. I agree. Yeah. I think the other very nice thing is the memo really stated our position so clearly, that really nothing else needs to be said. I even turned around and gave Aida a copy. I had some copies, so I gave her one. They had one, because that's how they... I'm sure. That's why they found out about it, and why, I guess, Chris was... Yeah. ...upset. Right. Right. Well... Yeah. Upset. Do you think upset? Uh, they, they have a parking problem, and they're so concerned that, um, if there's more parking over there, they'll have even more problems. So, so I, I bid, the parking of the library does need to be addressed. Yeah. I, I think we need a professional. Well... We're out there in some... Throughout, throughout, throughout the town needs to be addressed. Yeah. You know, that's, that's, that's, that's the way to, to think about it. But I think especially in the historic district, it needs to be. Um, but if you have parking on streets, you have people walking, you get people getting out of cars and walking about. And I just think that can't be a good thing. No, not on 27. Right. No. Or Route 20. Route 20. Oh, I think, I actually think it should happen on 20. I think it'll slow cars down and a couple of crosswalks. I mean, think about, think about, um, um, any of the town centers around us that we, we like. I mean, even the ones, even the ones that I think are, are nice, but aren't, aren't, don't, don't jump to my mind. Like a native center has parking in it on the streets. The main streets coming down. It's a very wide street. It, it, it is. Um, but it means people slow down and, um, you know, uh, the same thing with, the same thing, same thing is in, in, in, in, in, in concrete. Um, and yes, that's the nature of those, those town centers are different from ours, but I think the same principles about, about allowing for parking on roadways and getting people out of their car, actually walking on the sidewalks is a good thing. We, we do have some nice sidewalks. The thing that concerns me, uh, Desmond, is that the number of cars that take, that are on 27 is a tremendous number that come from Hudson and beyond. Yeah. I mean, people don't think about that, but they do. Right. And it, the traffic count was something like, I remember it was something like 22,000. Yeah. In a 24 hour period. Right. I mean, it's a huge number. And then the one on 20 is a little less than that. Yeah. So it's like a major highway. But I would say to you that if it takes people longer to go through that intersection, that's not a bad thing. Right. No, I agree. I agree. I think. I agree with that. Yeah. But that's just, that's just, that's kind of, we're not traffic engineers. No, but that's, that's urban design 101. It really kind of is. Yeah. And, um, and so we just, I think that just needs to be in the back of our head that, um, we're not here to ease, we're not, nobody's here to ease the speed of cars going through the town. No, no, no, no. I think, I think what our, what if, if, if, if, if we, I think it's much better to start thinking about slowing cars down as they come through the town center. Yeah. And it not being a traffic exchange, but being a town center. And then at crossroads, not a traffic stop. I guess my concern would be the safety. Yeah. More than, more than anything else. Well, that's where, that's where, that's where crosswalks. Yeah. Would, would, I mean, I've, I've a couple of times tried to, to go across, um, um, the street, um, uh, in the town, in, in, in, in, in, in the center of town and it's, you really gotta be quite careful. Yeah. It's not, it's hardly long enough to, uh, manage to get across. Cause when we did the, uh, walking tour. Yeah. Yeah. You know, we had, it took about three lights to get everybody. Yeah. So I think, I think we should be able to exert some control over the way 27 and 20 are utilized within the town. Yeah. And all the other options that we put in. Wow. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. And all the other topics, part in spots at the library behind the, uh, free notes, the free notes. Right? But they did not like that concept. Okay. So, I mean, you know, they're being protective of. of the library and we've thrown out the idea I wonder and again, Gretchen, you just said that it would be the planning board, not us they would look into grants but with the real trail being extended and even putting down a new crosswalk oh and you're going to laugh I have to cross the street tonight for the meeting in the gas company as you know right in front of my house is a small park they're moving that whole junction it's going to take two months and working at night Monday through Thursdays anyway they moved across the street they have these metal plates that you'd see that they're used on the road but it is between it's close to the road but it's between the museum and the library right exactly where the rail trail people had plans to have the crosswalk come in and to change the junction a little bit so it linked with the rail trail better but now these big plates are right there that's where the the doors are going to be for remember we had a meeting trying to encourage them to work together yes kind of you know national grid and for the bike bikes well I hope that we will be that Mike well Michael McCall the town manager will include the historic district in this group but yeah it's I mean I think we've done the best we've had and now we just have to keep our foot on the pedal yeah right so is there a motion here to record or is this discussion just discussion this is just discussion Gretchen do you think there's any chance if there's any rent relative to this as I was trying to say before the pavement the hard pavement that's going to be coming through and the rail trail do you think there's I don't know I mean I'm so I don't have any idea but the town planner should know that okay right yeah and we hope that Michael will contact him yeah or I can whisper to him yeah he really should be part of this discussion if he's going to pull everybody in it should be include our commission at the town planner yeah yes you're right and at least they have somebody but thank you for going well I'm sorry thank you for I didn't know that I should have asked to be on the agenda in person yeah as it turned out the phone conversation was worked out well but it was just the selectman they didn't let the library do you think no no the library nobody spoke the ball was talked right over to the town manager Michael do I have a motion to adjourn the new thing I guess you do so moving second second thank you all in favor all in favor you know what is great this is a well-run meeting Gretchen yes Gretchen yes Gretchen yes Sima yes Sima yes Sima yes okay well call Sima thank you we have a great but I guess we won't go we'll talk about that thank you no your thanks I'll talk about that everything again it's in the screen see what I've been doing