June 30, 2026 – Surface Water Quality Committee – Video & Transcript
June 30, 2026 - Surface Water Quality Committee
Why don't we go ahead and get started?
First, as always, because we're remote, I'll ask the committee members to announce their presence for the recording and for the record, and I'll start.
Tom Klem, present.
Tom Largy, I, present.
Steve Garone, present.
Great.
Thank you all.
All right.
Let's begin.
And that's at 7.01 p.m.
All right. Let me, and I apologize. I noticed I sent the committee members the agenda. What I had sent you was a draft that, as I opened it up this evening, I saw it was, like, all scattershot. It had random notes in it. So I'll send you the proper one that, fortunately, I sent it to the town. But I'll send you that later to save a proper agenda, not that thing that I sent you, which is a combination of minutes and agenda items. All right. Let me just check one thing, because I believe the first item is, yeah, public comment. And so, Anne, do you want to speak to your topic of interest? And then, as I said, if you'd like, we can continue that for the Dudley Pond part of the agenda. But if you want to just give us some background and introduction. I know Steve and I kind of know the high notes. But for Tom Largy's sake and just for the record, if you want to just give us the backstory. Okay. That'd be great. Thanks, Tom. So, Tom, I am a member of the Healthy Dudley Pond Committee. Anne, you're actually the chair of the committee. I am the chair. I guess I haven't integrated that role yet, but yes, I am the chair. And so, too... Sorry to interrupt that. Tom, you had a question? Yeah, I think you want to... This is the Healthy Dudley Pond Committee? Yeah, it's a committee. This is a new one to me. It's a committee. It's part of the Dudley Pond Association. Okay. That's all you need to know. Healthy Dudley Pond. Okay. Sorry, Anne. Sorry.
We shouldn't be showing up in you, so go ahead. No, that's great. So, Tom, the Dudley Pond Association has gotten a little reorganized with the help of Leif LeClaire. And it has included now that we've got committees that have more specific tasks. And so, we have the Healthy Dudley Pond Committee that is really charged with paying attention to the health of the pond and what resources are available to help us with that, including supporting the efforts to remove tapegrass, for instance, with the harvester, and to be supportive to the other efforts in Wayland to pay attention to stormwater runoff and fertilizer use and all the things that contributed to the nutrient load in the pond. So, this particular committee is especially focused on that. So, one of the things that we became aware of this spring was we had an algae bloom that we'd never had in the spring before. We had it last fall, but now for the very first – and it's not that we haven't ever had it, but it's always been later in the season, in the fall. And so, here in April, we're having algae bloom and, you know, to lots of concern among the abutters to the pond and trying to get a sense of what this is about and trying to get it tested. And it turns out that the report that – is it ARC? Is that the right organization? They actually included in their report that – did the Surface Water Quality Committee pay for that report, or was that Dudley Pond that paid for that? It was the committee, and I'll call that sheet up right now while you're talking. Okay. Okay. So, she actually identified that there was concern about algae bloom and recommended that we do some testing. The window for testing got passed, and so she's still recommending that the pond be tested for the factors that contribute to this algae bloom, but we have to get a sample from the bottom of the pond. And so, we're – and we need – we want to do it in coordination with surface water quality, you know, just in terms of making it happen and paying for it and figuring all – how do we follow the recommendations of the – of this report? Because it was a pretty important report. And just to pause you there, Ann, so for everyone – You're posting it, right, Tom? What's that, Steve? You're posting it, right? Yeah. Can you see it right now? It's right there. Yeah. So, Tom and Steve, what we're looking at is under conclusions and management implications, it's this last bullet point here about filamentous algae. Right. And this was one of the conclusions from Wendy Gendron and ARC when they did the flora and fauna survey on the pond last year. So, they recommended this action, and this ties into what Ann is telling us, the observation from this past spring. Right. Okay, Ann, back to you. So, that's one of the issues, questions. Can we coordinate our efforts in terms of doing the – you know, further evaluation? And how – how would that happen? What's the best for testing, figuring out how to pay for the testing, and staying on top of this issue around the algae bloom and what's causing it, and is it getting more significant, and how do we address this? So, that's one point in terms of my presence here. Tom, point of process, I guess. Do you want to follow your agenda, or do you want to, like, dive into this first? What did I have on the agenda? We had Dudley Pond first. I believe you had Herb Pond first.
Well, I would prefer Herb Pond. So, hang on, hang on. Hang on, hold it, everybody. So, Steve, as I said, what I sent you was the draft. I did put Dudley Pond first because I knew we were going to have this discussion. So, let me pause, and let me pause you there because we do have one item, which is to approve our minutes from our last meeting. But then we can go right into this. So, let me – let's just take a detour, and let's do that. So, before we continue on with the Dudley Pond discussion, I'd like to make a motion to approve the meeting minutes from May 26 that were circulated. Can I get a second on that? A second.
And let's do a roll call vote. Tom Klem, aye. Tom Largy, aye. Steve Garone, aye. All right. Thank you all.
All right. Are you seeing the agenda, or are you seeing still the report? I'm seeing the conclusions and management of the report. So, then let's – so, Ann gave us the background. I'm happy to jump in, but, Steve, do you want to take it from here? Ann talked about testing, but there's testing for algae, and there's what Wendy was suggesting in the report. But, Steve, I'll turn it over to you first. Let me just say a few words, and then, Tom, you can dive in as well. First of all, full disclosure, the committee that Ann talked about, I am on that committee. I believe you are, too, Tom. Is that right? Yeah. So, just to make that clear. I've been in correspondence with Wendy Gedron at ARC on and off for the last number of weeks. And, if you remember at our last meeting, we talked about getting a sample of the algae. She sent me the bottle, which has some sort of weird chemical in it you've got to be real careful with, that I was going to get a sample of. But nobody – I talked to everybody on our committee. I talked to Allison, everybody. Nobody could find the algae anymore. So, Wendy's reaction to that was, yeah, you can find it, but you're going to have to have a diver because it's really probably now around or even attached to some of the plants that are in the deep section of the pond that are fairly deep. So, I contacted Allison. I'm not a diver. I know she is. I contacted her as a first stab at a diver. She was having some issues last week with vertigo. So, I mean, that would obviously not be a good set of conditions under which for her, you know, she should dive. But she said probably next week she would be able to do it. So, yesterday morning, I delivered the bottle – sample bottle to her. And next week, she's going to go out and get a sample. I may be with her depending upon where I am. I may be up in Vermont. But she wanted the flexibility to do it on a day that worked for her. So, I believe next week we will have a sample that then I can send to the lab that will run the test. But, Tom, you're right. There's sampling and then there's sampling. There's first figuring out what this algae is, which is what this bottle is for. And then there's the larger picture, which Ann was talking about, which is a more comprehensive view that basically looks like, from what I can tell, repeating what Art did in September on Dudley Pond. Ann, am I right about that? Okay. So, let me chime in with my thoughts. Okay. So, Steve, that's good to know about the testing. The idea of getting an algae sample was, as you note, to identify what it was. Is it possibly one of the toxic strains or is it benign? That's one part of it. But Ann, to your original observation about that large, unexpected growth of algae so early in the year, was about what nutrients are in the pond that might be giving rise to these algal blooms, regardless of whatever species it is. So, Tom Largy, there are members of the HDPC and other members of the DPA that have been in contact with Wendy Gendron. And so, it sounds like she's in the process of putting together a quote to do this kind of comprehensive nutrient analysis of Dudley Pond. I don't know what the scope of it is. I don't know if it's the whole pond, like what Wendy had done last year, or a focused effort. Well, I've heard of these. Go ahead, Tom Largy. Yeah. By the way, Ann, I've been on this committee for over 25 years. And so, my principal interest has been herd pond and water chestlets. But we have a long, long history of testing on the pond. As an example, a number of years ago, for runoff, we spent quite a bit of money, as an example, below Simpson Road, a torrential rainstorm. And places like that, lots come into the pond. And that was measured.
By the way, it's pretty weedy in that area. I'm a fisherman, so I pay attention to water.
But, you know, for many, many years, we had quarterly testing done on the pond. The reports are there somewhere. Tom, are you talking about herd pond or Dudley pond? No, Dudley pond. Dudley pond. Yeah, there were quarterly reports. And, you know, the phosphorus load, I think, generally, if I recollect, phosphorus levels have been reasonable. There's a feeling that there's quite a bit of phosphorus in the sediment on the bottom. And there was historically been lots of discussions about what to do with it. As an example, alum. I was reading about Crystal Lake and Newton, a 33-acre lake. And they have, there was, I forget where that article was. It might have been in the Globe. And they applied alum. They still had algae recently. You know, it's a tough, tough thing. But lots of, lots of testing has been done. I, I'm sure more can be. But it's, ponds are tough, tough to deal with. That's all there is to it. So, yeah. And so, Tom, to that point, you'll notice this bullet point that we're looking at here. It's vague, right? It says more testing for nutrients. Nutrients undefined, location undefined. So, the HDPC, they already have a relationship with Wendy and ARC because they had done a report for the Dudley Pond Association five or so years back. So, they've reached out to, to her. And the whole idea is that all these activities ideally come through the committee. And if the DPA or the HDPC wants to do something, we are the conduit to engage with the talent for contracting and invoicing and so on. So, I don't know what the scope of this is going to look like. They've already engaged Wendy Gendron to do it. But what I had told certain elements, and Ann will convey to you here, is Wendy's going to try and, well, I don't know if she's going to try and do it this year. But I had made clear that this committee doesn't have money to support this. We used to get $50,000. Now it's $30,000. And it's spoken for for Herd Pond and then any ancillary activities on Dudley Pond. And so, where this will, so what will, once we get this quote, the question will be, how is it going to be paid for? So, the DPA made shoes to pay for. I don't know how high up those discussions have gone. There is, Ann, as you know, Dudley Pond has given, reimbursed the town every year until recently for the work the town does on Dudley Pond. I reached out to the town and I've learned there's $21,000 left in that so-called DPA gift fund. That could be an avenue. For that avenue to be tapped into, it would require me and yourself or other representatives to go before the select board to request that the money be used for that. So, depending on the time frame, the DPA will likely have to be the funding, well, either pay for it directly or use the gift fund. Right now, tomorrow, we're starting fiscal year 27 and we have $30,000. Next year, we'll probably have to do Procelacore, which means this fall we'll need to ask for quite a bit more for that. So, depending on the DPA or the HDPC's time frame for this, it could be quite some ways away. So, I think if there's a sense of urgency in your body or the larger DPA, it may have to come from either the DPA directly or, again, through that gift fund. But we'll see what Wendy comes back with. I have no idea what the scope of this is going to be, nor the cost. Okay. So, that's a perfect segue into my second thing that I'd like to just check in with. Let me just conclude on one point. So, the way this will work, then, is that if we proceed with this, the contract will come through this committee from ARC to the town. So, the town has a record of it. And then, however, whatever the payment's going to look like, I can handle that with through the town directly or the DPA or the HDPC. So, Wendy would send a proposal to you directly? Yes. Yeah. Okay. Wendy is sending the proposal to us, this committee. Okay. Okay. And, you know, I think one of the things I didn't say earlier, and I don't really know at this point whether or not Wendy is intending to address this in her proposal. I would think not, given my conversations with her, is that this last bullet on the screen really talks to a much larger picture than what she's done in the past in terms of testing. In the sense that she believes that what we really need is a more comprehensive assessment of all the possible ways that feeding goes into our pond. And, again, I don't think she's going to address that in what she's generating, but we should keep that in mind because that is really an issue for Dudley Pond. But I think, I agree, and I think when Wendy provides that, that'll be something to work off of. And she's the expert, obviously, but we might say, is this, you know, we'll rely on her expertise, but does it need to be perhaps more comprehensive than what she might provide? We'll just wait and see what she, because we certainly don't know. Again, she's the expert. This is one of her conclusions. That will mean something to her in terms of a scope of action. So we'll wait to get Wendy's quote, and then we'll pursue it from there. But whatever we end up with, if this is what the HDPC and the DPA agree to, it'll just go through the Surface Water Quality Committee. It's unlikely, if this wants to be, it's going to be done in the next few years, and I'm sure it is, that we could fund for it directly. So it might have to come through, again, the DPA or that gift fund. Right, right. So, again, what Steve is saying, Tom, what you were saying feeds right into what I wanted to talk with you next about, which is applying for what's called a 604B grant. Are you familiar with that? No, but I started looking when I got your email over the weekend. Yeah, I'm familiar with it. In fact, I didn't do it today. I was supposed to, but I was going to reach out to Melissa. Melissa is a member of the Dudley Pond Association. Let me pause you there. Sorry to interrupt. Just for Tom Largy's sake, because Tom Largy, there's, outside of the Surface Water Quality Committee, there's this committee that Ann's on, and Steve and I are part of the DPA. So we're privy to these things that you don't know about. So what Ann is talking about is other sources of revenue or funding to do research or support management of Dudley Pond. And Ann, do you want to talk about what a 604B is? I believe these are state grants, Tom. It's state grants, and it's actually not an implementation grant, but it is a, you have to apply for a 604B grant and get approved in order then to apply for what's called a 319, which is actually the grant that provides money for implementation. Can I pause you for my understanding? So the 604B is not the grant, that is, you get approved for a 604B, which allows you to apply for a grant through this 301, is that? 319. Yeah. So what is, what are you applying for in the 604B then? Okay. So it, I'll just read to you. It grants pay for planning work that helps a town or conservation district understand what's impairing the water body, how severe the pollution is, what solutions are needed, what pollutant load reductions are required, what designs or watershed-based plans are needed to fix the problem. These grants do not fund construction or on-the-ground invasive removal. They fund the analysis, mapping, monitoring, and design that lead to implementation. So we have to apply for this first and get approval so that, so that we can then get a grant that may contribute to buying a new harvester, for instance, for removal of plant, plant load. Okay. And other, and other. So I know that there's this grant that's already been applied for through Abby at the engineer in Wayland. I think my, as I read this, I think this is actually not competitive with the MVP grant 2.0. It is actually complementary to that process. But the reason I want to talk with this committee about that is because you are the body that it has to be, has to apply for it. It has to go through surface water quality. It has to be a town entity. Yeah, it has to be a town entity. That's true. And so my proposal to you is that if you're willing to support this, that the H, I can't remember how to say it, the HDPC committee will do the writing. We'll, we'll do the grant with your review and approval, but that you, we will not be asking you to do all the work that it will require. We'll do the work in service then of you being able to submit it because that's how it needs to get submitted. So I just, that's what I'm, that's my primary hope of talking with you tonight. This is essential. It's a lot of money, potential money. And once we can apply then for the implementation step, which is after you get approval of the 604B. Um, and so, you know, we have to follow that, that whole process, but it requires it going through the surface water quality committee. Steve, you said you had looked. Am I saying that correctly? Yeah. My understanding is that, uh, in this particular case, the DPA could not do this. No, I don't think we could. But we could do the work. We could do the work, but you, but, but a town entity will need to submit this. Right. On behalf of the town. Right. And are you available and interested in doing that if we do the work? And of course we would want your review and your input and, you know, your wisdom and all of that. We're not saying, you know, we wouldn't want you to be part of the process, but you've already, you know, you've got a lot of other things you're doing too. And, um, so that would be, that would be our proposal. Question, uh, Steve, uh, cause I took a quick look. I didn't see that there was anything that they were taking, uh, submissions for 2026, or maybe we had missed the deadline. We've missed the deadline. We've missed the deadline for 2026. We already knew that. It was this week. Deadline was this week. Okay. So we're looking at 27 to submit. Got it. Okay. Yeah. All right.
Well, I, you know, I, if I can just put my two cents in, the reason why I brought up Melissa's name is because I know Melissa, by the way, Tom Largy is a member of the Dudley Pond Association. And she has come to the meetings of this committee with a lot of knowledge of grants and how to develop them. Um, so she doesn't actually know about this one. She's learning with me. Yeah. Yeah. So, um, you know, there's a, I think, I think it's fair to say that there is a good, um, um, uh, body of, of knowledge and energy in this committee to do the work, to get that developed. So, you know, from, from the committee's perspective here, um, I don't see any reason why we shouldn't wholeheartedly support that effort.
Tom, you've gotten, uh, you've gotten, um, muted. Steve, I was going to ask you to, to make a motion on that because if we are, I, cause I, uh, if we're going to engage in this, it needs to be an official motion and approved by this. So, and what, what, um, I just want to understand specifically what you want. You, you want the committee to decide, um, uh, that, uh, we will work with the Dudley Pond Association to develop and bring to the Commonwealth of Massachusetts. It's a 604B application. Yeah. I mean, that's, I mean, that would be great if you're available to develop it. Uh, that's beyond my, my request. My request is that once we, we will develop it, we will then send it to you for your review, your critique, your input. And as we can sort out what, you know, that we can all be in agreement about what to submit, then, then you, then the Surface Water Quality Committee will be willing to submit it.
Can you make a motion out of that, Tom? Uh, sure. I did very well, but it, it needs to be a little more concise. No, it's going to be, yeah, it'll be pretty brief. I'll, I'll make the motion then. Uh, so motion for the Surface Water Quality Committee to, uh, on behalf of the Dudley Pond Association to submit a 604B grant in 2027, uh, for, uh, let me pause there. So, uh, and you said this is not, this would not be for any kind of weed management. This is a, this is for more for analysis. Usability study. It's, it's analysis and mapping. Um, and it's a requirement in order to then apply for the implementation grant.
Okay. I'm just going to call it a feasibility study. Okay. Uh, Tom Largy, I mean, I, I, you know, again, Steve and I are, wear multiple hats. We're on the DPA. Um, do you, do you have any objection to this? I mean, this is something we would, it's some of the, uh, DPA or the HDPC will be doing the primary work. And like with the contract, we are the entity of this will sort of flow through, if you will. Uh, I, I, I don't have any objection, uh, uh, whatsoever. I, I would say as, as, uh, as we're constituted right now, uh, the surface water quality committee would, uh, be unable to, uh, maybe not unable, but it would be a tough, tough, uh, job to put together this, uh, 604B application. I did this about, uh, 12 years ago for, uh, a grant for Herd Pond and, uh, I found it, uh, onerous and difficult. Finally got the grant, but, uh, it was just plain, I, I, I wouldn't want to do it again. Oh, yeah, yeah. Well, you know, you know, Tom, I would completely appreciate what you're saying and thank goodness, you know, I know it's controversial, but thank goodness for AI because it's really helpful. Yeah. With this process. All right. So I will, I'll make, I'll start over with the motion, but I want to just try and in this motion, which will be concise, I want to try and capture what this is. So this is not, this is, it's analysis, but are we thinking about a kind of chemical treatment? Is this for a manual harvesting of plants? So like, what is, what is like the high level? I would imagine both. Both removal of, of, of, of plants and chemical treatment. Because we need to, we're going to need to continue to treat for milfoil. We can't use mechanical for milfoil and we've got, you know, as you know, you know, milfoil is going to be treated again next year. So I would say both. Okay. I'll call it. I'm going to cover everything. I mean, you know, but the typical award is between 25,000 and a hundred thousand. Well, this is for the 604B just to do the analysis. I don't know what the amount of the grant for 319 is. Okay. So this part, this 604B is not going to have anything to do with actual physical weed management. Oh, it won't. Okay. But in order to apply for the grant that will be about weed management, we have to do this first. Okay. But we're just focusing on the 604B now. And the other one is a 319. That'll be some later. 319. Okay. So I'm going to call this, I'll rephrase the motion. I'm going to call it a feasibility study on nutrient sources for, I'll just leave it at that, nutrients, flora and nutrient sources on Dudley Pond. I'll leave it at that. I don't know if this belongs in the motion, but I would be happy to serve as the, since I'm kind of on this committee anyway, HDBC, I would be happy to serve as the liaison to this committee for that work. Okay. That's, that's fine. That doesn't need to be, that doesn't need to be part of the motion. What if we, um, if approved, uh, and if the ball gets rolling, you can be that, that conduit between Anne's committee and our, our committee. All right. So let me, uh, go back and make the motion. So, uh, before the committee, uh, is a motion to submit on behalf of the Dudley Pond Association, a 604B grant, uh, for a feasibility study, uh, on nutrient sources, uh, for, um, weed management on Dudley Pond in, uh, in 20, for it to be submitted in 2027. Yeah. I'll second. Thank you. And let's do, go around the virtual room for, uh, we'll call vote. Tom Largy, aye. Steve Garone, aye. Tom Klem, aye. Awesome. Thanks, Anne. So we'll, um, as we have our meetings going forward, we can have you back when Wendy gets her report in, or as we, as the 604B business gets off the ground, you or anybody on the committee will have you come back and give updates or just converse, whatever. Okay. Okay. Sure. That sounds great. Awesome. Good. I have a non-business question to ask, Anne. Were you out on the pond last night? I think you were. Yeah, we were. We were struggling because our engine's been having trouble. So we were doing little circles in front of our house with the hope that we weren't going to have to paddle back. We had, we had a full moon party last night on the pond. It was amazing. Anyway. Yeah. We did. I told you it was non-business. Yeah. Yeah. It was great. All right, Anne. Thank you so much. We didn't want to come all the way over to you guys because we were afraid you would not have to tow us back. We were going to have to ask you to tow us back and we didn't want to interfere with the moon sighting. Got it. Okay. All right. Thanks, Anne. Okay. Thank you. Have a good night. Bye. All right. Take care. Bye.
All right. Moving on to Herd Pun. And Tom Larga, do you want to start with your, with the update on what the water chestnuts are looking like? Yeah, right. Per my note, I did not go out personally. I've been struggling with a couple of things. One is my, my, my shoulder. The, and I would, I can't take my small boat out. I flat can't. Turns out my larger boat has a whole saga with that. And, uh, but, um, I I'm in shape, but, uh, uh, I was telling Steve Garone a little bit of that, uh, anyway, uh, but this fellow, uh, Josh, uh, hurting who lives in the, uh, large house at the, uh, end of, uh, Pelham Island road and, uh, Landon road as a garage, uh, a barn there. He's got a pineapple painted on it. He's got a bass boat inside. He's, um, on the, uh, pond, um, easily a hundred or more days a year. So, um, and I've been out with him a couple of times. So I, I trust his observation and, uh, uh, uh, and simply, uh, put, uh, on the open water areas, it's sporadic. That's about what, uh, I've come up with in past years. And, uh, he felt the, uh, South Cove might not be, uh, quite as infested, but nevertheless, where it is infested, uh, you know, there are mats of, uh, uh, of, uh, water chestnut plants on the surface, uh, Tom Klem's been out there with me. He knows what we're talking about. So, um, it's, it's very simple. Uh, uh, they should start, uh, the clear cast treatment right away for the first of the treatments and, uh, start her harvesting. Uh, uh, I was, uh, was it this morning? Yeah, I was there this morning. Saw that, um, water chestnut rosette, uh, washed up, uh, must have been. And somebody out with a boat and this is in the launch area and, uh, it's only the end of June, but, uh, uh, uh, the plants are well along in maturity. Uh, the pond's been, uh, uh, very low water level for, uh, some weeks now as has been the, uh, Sudbury river. There's just plenty of drought going on and, uh, it's likely that, uh, there are going to be lots more plants. Uh, that's all there is to it. It's, uh, uh, we should start treatment or harvesting on the pond as soon as possible. Tom, question on the, on the timing. I know when they did clear cast last year, they did two treatments a couple of weeks apart. Should, is, uh, is your recommendation that we do the clear cast first, both applications and then what's done that have the crews come in and do the hand pulling? No, I, I, I would say the, uh, crew should do the hand pulling as, uh, as soon as possible. And it has to do with biomass, uh, as these, uh, uh, what's a single rosette now in, uh, just two or three or four weeks could be, uh, a, uh, a daisy chain of rosettes. And, uh, uh, so, uh, uh, it's, the biomass is a whole lot less right now than it is, than it will be, uh, later in July. I think they should start immediately because they generally have, because I don't want them to do, because I think it would be disruptive. You can tell me otherwise, if they were to do some hand harvesting now, then they do the first treatment of clear cast and the guys come in and pull plants up. Can these things overlap or do they? No, I, I don't see any overlap. Those are entirely different parts of the pond. Um, uh, so you're saying, okay, so the clear cast is going to be South Cove. The hand harvesting is everywhere else. Everywhere else. Yeah. Okay. There's, uh, there's no conflict whatsoever. Okay. Perfect. Okay. I will get the word out to, uh, Jeff and, uh, Tanner. Those contracts have been signed. If I didn't send those to you guys, apologies, I'll make, I'll check and I'll send them to you as you have them. Um, okay. Uh, and then this is, thank you, Tom. I appreciate that. So I will get in touch with those guys. Both contracts have been signed at the last meeting when we last meeting, I reported on the phone call that I had with Stephanie Koch, uh, Koch and Tanner and Solitude and Emily Cuellar from conservation was there. So, uh, the first thing was that, uh, to expand the scope of clear cast treatment would require, uh, a special permit from the fish and wildlife service, which, uh, we're not going to be able to do this year. They're swamped. We'll apply for it in the fall. So we have it for next year. So we're going to be within the confines of herd pond as we were last year. Uh, but I did give Stephanie the news that we're going to hand harvest. She gave me the thumbs up, said, thank you for letting me know. So we have there. Okay. So we're, we're good to go on, uh, the hand harvesting for the clear cast. And what I didn't realize last year when we got approval was that that was only good for one year. I assumed it was for a window of time, like with Priscilla core, Emily Cuellar made me aware that, no, you only had it for last year, not for this year. So I had to go before concom, which was the day, day after we last met and I explained the situation and they gave me the approval. In fact, I'm like, I don't think Linda sent me to know yet, but we do have the approval to do clear cast again this year. Uh, I'll follow up with Linda to get that note. So we are all clear to engage in these activities. So Tom, I'll take the lead and reach out to, uh, Tanner and Jeff and have those guys scrounge up whoever they can. Who's got a boat, a canoe, a paddleboard, and just get out there and start laying waste of this stuff. Okay. Tom, I am grateful that you did all of that. Uh, thank you. Oh, you're welcome. It was, like I said, it's, it's emails, it's meetings. It's, it's pretty light, light lift. I know it's a bureaucracy kind of thing and a pain, but I guess I'm used to it for my, for my job. Glad to help out.
All right. Uh, I think that was it. Our usual big two. Let's see. Contract status. Clear cast. Well, uh, a point of, uh, uh, well, that's all for heard, but, uh, back to Dudley, uh, when is the, uh, Steve, when do you think the harvesting will start for, uh, uh, uh, for tape grass? Uh, I think, um, what I heard was, um, first or second week of July, my guess would be after next week, but I could be off by a few days. I, I don't remember. Yeah. I think that's early to mid July. And, you know, I, based on what I've seen out there, um, that's good because I think the tape grass is going to be a major issue soon, very soon, but it isn't right at this minute. In fact, when I look at my propeller, when I come back, it's all the other weed, you know? The other weed, so not in the milfoil? No. Um, the. What's, what's, what's popping up now? Um, why am I not remembering? Clasping something? Pearly leaf pond weed. Pearly leaf. Thank you. Okay. Yeah. Okay. Uh, which is, which is not as disruptive to motors as tape grass, but it's still, still not great. Well, I was out on the pond, as I was mentioning to Steve, uh, I, uh, uh, had to get a boat in and off. And, uh, uh, my observation was I, uh, the route I took, uh, I didn't see any tape grass to, uh, uh, speak of. I saw quite a bit of other weeds and my prop was similarly, uh, uh, uh, is just loaded with lots of stuff, uh, that was taking it in off mention beach.
Yeah. So, you know, I think, I think the fact that it hasn't been started yet is probably good, but I'm seeing signs of it. So. Is this, is this curly leaf is now sort of the, the next thing, you know, just taking over the tape grass. So we had the tape grass take over the milfoil. Well, now this curly leaf is out competing tape grass or it's just a new player in the mix. I think, I think the, the curly leaf is going to, uh, sort of not die out, but become less, less relevant than tape grass over the next week or two. Uh, yeah, that's, uh, as long as I've been on the committee, uh, you know, there've been discussions on this going way back when it was just milfoil versus curly leaf. The curly leaf, uh, uh, seems pretty prevalent, but apparently it dies back, uh, very early in July. And that's, uh, okay. The grass is coming. All right. Awesome. All right. Uh, that is our agenda for the day. I'd like to discuss, uh, a next meeting date and I'm looking at a second week of August cause I'll be gone the first week. So, uh, 10th, 11th and 12th, that's a Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, and August. Okay. Let me pull up my calendar. I already know that we'll be, uh, around, uh, we'll be away, uh, in a mid July, but, uh, I'm not going anywhere in early August. I don't think I am either. Tom, that mid July trip, is that the one that you were going to, you're still going to go, but now it's, you're not going to be able to fish. Well, I, I, I was at a physical therapist, uh, today. And, uh, uh, uh, I, I, I went in to see the surgeon that I, I may have, I don't know if I, about three weeks ago. And he, uh, this is, um, you know, the, uh, what the heck was, uh, and, um, he said, well, we could, you could do surgery, but that wouldn't be very much fun. And, uh, maybe you can, um, uh, uh, my, uh, uh, what the heck is it? Uh, why do I always forget on my shoulder? Or what do they call that, uh, uh, rotator cuff, rotator cuff, hanging by a thread. Uh, I hear, I hear everybody's got that problem lately. Everybody I've talked to. Well, I was, uh, fly fishing today, uh, just to prove that I can, and I can't do it as well, but I can do it. So, um, I, uh, uh, uh, you know, I've, I've got a big fly fishing trip out to Washington State, uh, uh, week long, the end of September. So that, that's, that's a big deal. We'll be on the river all day, every day, making hundreds of casts. And, um, uh, so, uh, I, I'm hoping, I'm hoping I shape up from that. It's been pointed out, pointed out that maybe I should, uh, I don't know if, uh, oh, there's an issue with, uh, oh, stamina and wearing out the arm and this and that. So maybe I'd just take half as many casts. I don't know. Go along for the boat ride. But, uh, anyway, I sent a check in today for a portion of the trip, which.
Okay. So what dates did you say, Tom? Uh, I'm looking at Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, August 10, 11, 12. Okay. Okay. Well, so any of them will work for me, but I want to, again, say that once the fall rolls around, uh, second Tuesday of the month and every Wednesday will not be available. All right. Well, we'll, we'll deal with that in the fall, but right now. So let's. Summertime, it's okay. So, so let's go with Tuesday then, because we more or less be on Tuesday. So Tom Largie, August 11th, Tuesday. Yeah. August 11th, a Tuesday. Now, Larry Kiernan is not on. Um, I, um, I don't know what his schedule will be, uh, hard to say, but it's fine with me. Tuesday will. All right. So let's, so let me, why don't you, so what I'll do is I'll, I'll send Larry a text. Uh, let me know, both of you, uh, are the 10th and the 12th also going to work? I mean, 11th will be my priority, but if Larry can do, can't do that, but he can do the 10th or the 12th, does that work for you guys? Yeah, yeah, that's fine. They all work. Okay. So I'll prioritize the 11th, but if Larry can only meet one of the other days and we'll meet on one of those other days. Okay. Awesome. Uh, I think we broke a time record, didn't we? Uh, pretty close to it. 45 minutes is a pretty, pretty tight and concise meeting. Um, guys have a great 4th of July. I moved to adjourn. Okay. Not yet. I'm saying my, I'm sorry. I thought you would say goodbye. So I'm like, you can't do that. No, I gotta make a motion. So you can make them. Okay. So that was my glad tidings for you all. Uh, Steve, you want to make a motion to adjourn at 7 46 PM? I guess I kind of did. I still hear thunder. Uh, I make a motion to adjourn at 7 46 PM. It's our second. I'll second it. All right. Thank you. Uh, let's go around the room. Tom Largy. I see your own.
All right. Let me, and I apologize. I noticed I sent the committee members the agenda. What I had sent you was a draft that, as I opened it up this evening, I saw it was, like, all scattershot. It had random notes in it. So I'll send you the proper one that, fortunately, I sent it to the town. But I'll send you that later to save a proper agenda, not that thing that I sent you, which is a combination of minutes and agenda items. All right. Let me just check one thing, because I believe the first item is, yeah, public comment. And so, Anne, do you want to speak to your topic of interest? And then, as I said, if you'd like, we can continue that for the Dudley Pond part of the agenda. But if you want to just give us some background and introduction. I know Steve and I kind of know the high notes. But for Tom Largy's sake and just for the record, if you want to just give us the backstory. Okay. That'd be great. Thanks, Tom. So, Tom, I am a member of the Healthy Dudley Pond Committee. Anne, you're actually the chair of the committee. I am the chair. I guess I haven't integrated that role yet, but yes, I am the chair. And so, too... Sorry to interrupt that. Tom, you had a question? Yeah, I think you want to... This is the Healthy Dudley Pond Committee? Yeah, it's a committee. This is a new one to me. It's a committee. It's part of the Dudley Pond Association. Okay. That's all you need to know. Healthy Dudley Pond. Okay. Sorry, Anne. Sorry.
We shouldn't be showing up in you, so go ahead. No, that's great. So, Tom, the Dudley Pond Association has gotten a little reorganized with the help of Leif LeClaire. And it has included now that we've got committees that have more specific tasks. And so, we have the Healthy Dudley Pond Committee that is really charged with paying attention to the health of the pond and what resources are available to help us with that, including supporting the efforts to remove tapegrass, for instance, with the harvester, and to be supportive to the other efforts in Wayland to pay attention to stormwater runoff and fertilizer use and all the things that contributed to the nutrient load in the pond. So, this particular committee is especially focused on that. So, one of the things that we became aware of this spring was we had an algae bloom that we'd never had in the spring before. We had it last fall, but now for the very first – and it's not that we haven't ever had it, but it's always been later in the season, in the fall. And so, here in April, we're having algae bloom and, you know, to lots of concern among the abutters to the pond and trying to get a sense of what this is about and trying to get it tested. And it turns out that the report that – is it ARC? Is that the right organization? They actually included in their report that – did the Surface Water Quality Committee pay for that report, or was that Dudley Pond that paid for that? It was the committee, and I'll call that sheet up right now while you're talking. Okay. Okay. So, she actually identified that there was concern about algae bloom and recommended that we do some testing. The window for testing got passed, and so she's still recommending that the pond be tested for the factors that contribute to this algae bloom, but we have to get a sample from the bottom of the pond. And so, we're – and we need – we want to do it in coordination with surface water quality, you know, just in terms of making it happen and paying for it and figuring all – how do we follow the recommendations of the – of this report? Because it was a pretty important report. And just to pause you there, Ann, so for everyone – You're posting it, right, Tom? What's that, Steve? You're posting it, right? Yeah. Can you see it right now? It's right there. Yeah. So, Tom and Steve, what we're looking at is under conclusions and management implications, it's this last bullet point here about filamentous algae. Right. And this was one of the conclusions from Wendy Gendron and ARC when they did the flora and fauna survey on the pond last year. So, they recommended this action, and this ties into what Ann is telling us, the observation from this past spring. Right. Okay, Ann, back to you. So, that's one of the issues, questions. Can we coordinate our efforts in terms of doing the – you know, further evaluation? And how – how would that happen? What's the best for testing, figuring out how to pay for the testing, and staying on top of this issue around the algae bloom and what's causing it, and is it getting more significant, and how do we address this? So, that's one point in terms of my presence here. Tom, point of process, I guess. Do you want to follow your agenda, or do you want to, like, dive into this first? What did I have on the agenda? We had Dudley Pond first. I believe you had Herb Pond first.
Well, I would prefer Herb Pond. So, hang on, hang on. Hang on, hold it, everybody. So, Steve, as I said, what I sent you was the draft. I did put Dudley Pond first because I knew we were going to have this discussion. So, let me pause, and let me pause you there because we do have one item, which is to approve our minutes from our last meeting. But then we can go right into this. So, let me – let's just take a detour, and let's do that. So, before we continue on with the Dudley Pond discussion, I'd like to make a motion to approve the meeting minutes from May 26 that were circulated. Can I get a second on that? A second.
And let's do a roll call vote. Tom Klem, aye. Tom Largy, aye. Steve Garone, aye. All right. Thank you all.
All right. Are you seeing the agenda, or are you seeing still the report? I'm seeing the conclusions and management of the report. So, then let's – so, Ann gave us the background. I'm happy to jump in, but, Steve, do you want to take it from here? Ann talked about testing, but there's testing for algae, and there's what Wendy was suggesting in the report. But, Steve, I'll turn it over to you first. Let me just say a few words, and then, Tom, you can dive in as well. First of all, full disclosure, the committee that Ann talked about, I am on that committee. I believe you are, too, Tom. Is that right? Yeah. So, just to make that clear. I've been in correspondence with Wendy Gedron at ARC on and off for the last number of weeks. And, if you remember at our last meeting, we talked about getting a sample of the algae. She sent me the bottle, which has some sort of weird chemical in it you've got to be real careful with, that I was going to get a sample of. But nobody – I talked to everybody on our committee. I talked to Allison, everybody. Nobody could find the algae anymore. So, Wendy's reaction to that was, yeah, you can find it, but you're going to have to have a diver because it's really probably now around or even attached to some of the plants that are in the deep section of the pond that are fairly deep. So, I contacted Allison. I'm not a diver. I know she is. I contacted her as a first stab at a diver. She was having some issues last week with vertigo. So, I mean, that would obviously not be a good set of conditions under which for her, you know, she should dive. But she said probably next week she would be able to do it. So, yesterday morning, I delivered the bottle – sample bottle to her. And next week, she's going to go out and get a sample. I may be with her depending upon where I am. I may be up in Vermont. But she wanted the flexibility to do it on a day that worked for her. So, I believe next week we will have a sample that then I can send to the lab that will run the test. But, Tom, you're right. There's sampling and then there's sampling. There's first figuring out what this algae is, which is what this bottle is for. And then there's the larger picture, which Ann was talking about, which is a more comprehensive view that basically looks like, from what I can tell, repeating what Art did in September on Dudley Pond. Ann, am I right about that? Okay. So, let me chime in with my thoughts. Okay. So, Steve, that's good to know about the testing. The idea of getting an algae sample was, as you note, to identify what it was. Is it possibly one of the toxic strains or is it benign? That's one part of it. But Ann, to your original observation about that large, unexpected growth of algae so early in the year, was about what nutrients are in the pond that might be giving rise to these algal blooms, regardless of whatever species it is. So, Tom Largy, there are members of the HDPC and other members of the DPA that have been in contact with Wendy Gendron. And so, it sounds like she's in the process of putting together a quote to do this kind of comprehensive nutrient analysis of Dudley Pond. I don't know what the scope of it is. I don't know if it's the whole pond, like what Wendy had done last year, or a focused effort. Well, I've heard of these. Go ahead, Tom Largy. Yeah. By the way, Ann, I've been on this committee for over 25 years. And so, my principal interest has been herd pond and water chestlets. But we have a long, long history of testing on the pond. As an example, a number of years ago, for runoff, we spent quite a bit of money, as an example, below Simpson Road, a torrential rainstorm. And places like that, lots come into the pond. And that was measured.
By the way, it's pretty weedy in that area. I'm a fisherman, so I pay attention to water.
But, you know, for many, many years, we had quarterly testing done on the pond. The reports are there somewhere. Tom, are you talking about herd pond or Dudley pond? No, Dudley pond. Dudley pond. Yeah, there were quarterly reports. And, you know, the phosphorus load, I think, generally, if I recollect, phosphorus levels have been reasonable. There's a feeling that there's quite a bit of phosphorus in the sediment on the bottom. And there was historically been lots of discussions about what to do with it. As an example, alum. I was reading about Crystal Lake and Newton, a 33-acre lake. And they have, there was, I forget where that article was. It might have been in the Globe. And they applied alum. They still had algae recently. You know, it's a tough, tough thing. But lots of, lots of testing has been done. I, I'm sure more can be. But it's, ponds are tough, tough to deal with. That's all there is to it. So, yeah. And so, Tom, to that point, you'll notice this bullet point that we're looking at here. It's vague, right? It says more testing for nutrients. Nutrients undefined, location undefined. So, the HDPC, they already have a relationship with Wendy and ARC because they had done a report for the Dudley Pond Association five or so years back. So, they've reached out to, to her. And the whole idea is that all these activities ideally come through the committee. And if the DPA or the HDPC wants to do something, we are the conduit to engage with the talent for contracting and invoicing and so on. So, I don't know what the scope of this is going to look like. They've already engaged Wendy Gendron to do it. But what I had told certain elements, and Ann will convey to you here, is Wendy's going to try and, well, I don't know if she's going to try and do it this year. But I had made clear that this committee doesn't have money to support this. We used to get $50,000. Now it's $30,000. And it's spoken for for Herd Pond and then any ancillary activities on Dudley Pond. And so, where this will, so what will, once we get this quote, the question will be, how is it going to be paid for? So, the DPA made shoes to pay for. I don't know how high up those discussions have gone. There is, Ann, as you know, Dudley Pond has given, reimbursed the town every year until recently for the work the town does on Dudley Pond. I reached out to the town and I've learned there's $21,000 left in that so-called DPA gift fund. That could be an avenue. For that avenue to be tapped into, it would require me and yourself or other representatives to go before the select board to request that the money be used for that. So, depending on the time frame, the DPA will likely have to be the funding, well, either pay for it directly or use the gift fund. Right now, tomorrow, we're starting fiscal year 27 and we have $30,000. Next year, we'll probably have to do Procelacore, which means this fall we'll need to ask for quite a bit more for that. So, depending on the DPA or the HDPC's time frame for this, it could be quite some ways away. So, I think if there's a sense of urgency in your body or the larger DPA, it may have to come from either the DPA directly or, again, through that gift fund. But we'll see what Wendy comes back with. I have no idea what the scope of this is going to be, nor the cost. Okay. So, that's a perfect segue into my second thing that I'd like to just check in with. Let me just conclude on one point. So, the way this will work, then, is that if we proceed with this, the contract will come through this committee from ARC to the town. So, the town has a record of it. And then, however, whatever the payment's going to look like, I can handle that with through the town directly or the DPA or the HDPC. So, Wendy would send a proposal to you directly? Yes. Yeah. Okay. Wendy is sending the proposal to us, this committee. Okay. Okay. And, you know, I think one of the things I didn't say earlier, and I don't really know at this point whether or not Wendy is intending to address this in her proposal. I would think not, given my conversations with her, is that this last bullet on the screen really talks to a much larger picture than what she's done in the past in terms of testing. In the sense that she believes that what we really need is a more comprehensive assessment of all the possible ways that feeding goes into our pond. And, again, I don't think she's going to address that in what she's generating, but we should keep that in mind because that is really an issue for Dudley Pond. But I think, I agree, and I think when Wendy provides that, that'll be something to work off of. And she's the expert, obviously, but we might say, is this, you know, we'll rely on her expertise, but does it need to be perhaps more comprehensive than what she might provide? We'll just wait and see what she, because we certainly don't know. Again, she's the expert. This is one of her conclusions. That will mean something to her in terms of a scope of action. So we'll wait to get Wendy's quote, and then we'll pursue it from there. But whatever we end up with, if this is what the HDPC and the DPA agree to, it'll just go through the Surface Water Quality Committee. It's unlikely, if this wants to be, it's going to be done in the next few years, and I'm sure it is, that we could fund for it directly. So it might have to come through, again, the DPA or that gift fund. Right, right. So, again, what Steve is saying, Tom, what you were saying feeds right into what I wanted to talk with you next about, which is applying for what's called a 604B grant. Are you familiar with that? No, but I started looking when I got your email over the weekend. Yeah, I'm familiar with it. In fact, I didn't do it today. I was supposed to, but I was going to reach out to Melissa. Melissa is a member of the Dudley Pond Association. Let me pause you there. Sorry to interrupt. Just for Tom Largy's sake, because Tom Largy, there's, outside of the Surface Water Quality Committee, there's this committee that Ann's on, and Steve and I are part of the DPA. So we're privy to these things that you don't know about. So what Ann is talking about is other sources of revenue or funding to do research or support management of Dudley Pond. And Ann, do you want to talk about what a 604B is? I believe these are state grants, Tom. It's state grants, and it's actually not an implementation grant, but it is a, you have to apply for a 604B grant and get approved in order then to apply for what's called a 319, which is actually the grant that provides money for implementation. Can I pause you for my understanding? So the 604B is not the grant, that is, you get approved for a 604B, which allows you to apply for a grant through this 301, is that? 319. Yeah. So what is, what are you applying for in the 604B then? Okay. So it, I'll just read to you. It grants pay for planning work that helps a town or conservation district understand what's impairing the water body, how severe the pollution is, what solutions are needed, what pollutant load reductions are required, what designs or watershed-based plans are needed to fix the problem. These grants do not fund construction or on-the-ground invasive removal. They fund the analysis, mapping, monitoring, and design that lead to implementation. So we have to apply for this first and get approval so that, so that we can then get a grant that may contribute to buying a new harvester, for instance, for removal of plant, plant load. Okay. And other, and other. So I know that there's this grant that's already been applied for through Abby at the engineer in Wayland. I think my, as I read this, I think this is actually not competitive with the MVP grant 2.0. It is actually complementary to that process. But the reason I want to talk with this committee about that is because you are the body that it has to be, has to apply for it. It has to go through surface water quality. It has to be a town entity. Yeah, it has to be a town entity. That's true. And so my proposal to you is that if you're willing to support this, that the H, I can't remember how to say it, the HDPC committee will do the writing. We'll, we'll do the grant with your review and approval, but that you, we will not be asking you to do all the work that it will require. We'll do the work in service then of you being able to submit it because that's how it needs to get submitted. So I just, that's what I'm, that's my primary hope of talking with you tonight. This is essential. It's a lot of money, potential money. And once we can apply then for the implementation step, which is after you get approval of the 604B. Um, and so, you know, we have to follow that, that whole process, but it requires it going through the surface water quality committee. Steve, you said you had looked. Am I saying that correctly? Yeah. My understanding is that, uh, in this particular case, the DPA could not do this. No, I don't think we could. But we could do the work. We could do the work, but you, but, but a town entity will need to submit this. Right. On behalf of the town. Right. And are you available and interested in doing that if we do the work? And of course we would want your review and your input and, you know, your wisdom and all of that. We're not saying, you know, we wouldn't want you to be part of the process, but you've already, you know, you've got a lot of other things you're doing too. And, um, so that would be, that would be our proposal. Question, uh, Steve, uh, cause I took a quick look. I didn't see that there was anything that they were taking, uh, submissions for 2026, or maybe we had missed the deadline. We've missed the deadline. We've missed the deadline for 2026. We already knew that. It was this week. Deadline was this week. Okay. So we're looking at 27 to submit. Got it. Okay. Yeah. All right.
Well, I, you know, I, if I can just put my two cents in, the reason why I brought up Melissa's name is because I know Melissa, by the way, Tom Largy is a member of the Dudley Pond Association. And she has come to the meetings of this committee with a lot of knowledge of grants and how to develop them. Um, so she doesn't actually know about this one. She's learning with me. Yeah. Yeah. So, um, you know, there's a, I think, I think it's fair to say that there is a good, um, um, uh, body of, of knowledge and energy in this committee to do the work, to get that developed. So, you know, from, from the committee's perspective here, um, I don't see any reason why we shouldn't wholeheartedly support that effort.
Tom, you've gotten, uh, you've gotten, um, muted. Steve, I was going to ask you to, to make a motion on that because if we are, I, cause I, uh, if we're going to engage in this, it needs to be an official motion and approved by this. So, and what, what, um, I just want to understand specifically what you want. You, you want the committee to decide, um, uh, that, uh, we will work with the Dudley Pond Association to develop and bring to the Commonwealth of Massachusetts. It's a 604B application. Yeah. I mean, that's, I mean, that would be great if you're available to develop it. Uh, that's beyond my, my request. My request is that once we, we will develop it, we will then send it to you for your review, your critique, your input. And as we can sort out what, you know, that we can all be in agreement about what to submit, then, then you, then the Surface Water Quality Committee will be willing to submit it.
Can you make a motion out of that, Tom? Uh, sure. I did very well, but it, it needs to be a little more concise. No, it's going to be, yeah, it'll be pretty brief. I'll, I'll make the motion then. Uh, so motion for the Surface Water Quality Committee to, uh, on behalf of the Dudley Pond Association to submit a 604B grant in 2027, uh, for, uh, let me pause there. So, uh, and you said this is not, this would not be for any kind of weed management. This is a, this is for more for analysis. Usability study. It's, it's analysis and mapping. Um, and it's a requirement in order to then apply for the implementation grant.
Okay. I'm just going to call it a feasibility study. Okay. Uh, Tom Largy, I mean, I, I, you know, again, Steve and I are, wear multiple hats. We're on the DPA. Um, do you, do you have any objection to this? I mean, this is something we would, it's some of the, uh, DPA or the HDPC will be doing the primary work. And like with the contract, we are the entity of this will sort of flow through, if you will. Uh, I, I, I don't have any objection, uh, uh, whatsoever. I, I would say as, as, uh, as we're constituted right now, uh, the surface water quality committee would, uh, be unable to, uh, maybe not unable, but it would be a tough, tough, uh, job to put together this, uh, 604B application. I did this about, uh, 12 years ago for, uh, a grant for Herd Pond and, uh, I found it, uh, onerous and difficult. Finally got the grant, but, uh, it was just plain, I, I, I wouldn't want to do it again. Oh, yeah, yeah. Well, you know, you know, Tom, I would completely appreciate what you're saying and thank goodness, you know, I know it's controversial, but thank goodness for AI because it's really helpful. Yeah. With this process. All right. So I will, I'll make, I'll start over with the motion, but I want to just try and in this motion, which will be concise, I want to try and capture what this is. So this is not, this is, it's analysis, but are we thinking about a kind of chemical treatment? Is this for a manual harvesting of plants? So like, what is, what is like the high level? I would imagine both. Both removal of, of, of, of plants and chemical treatment. Because we need to, we're going to need to continue to treat for milfoil. We can't use mechanical for milfoil and we've got, you know, as you know, you know, milfoil is going to be treated again next year. So I would say both. Okay. I'll call it. I'm going to cover everything. I mean, you know, but the typical award is between 25,000 and a hundred thousand. Well, this is for the 604B just to do the analysis. I don't know what the amount of the grant for 319 is. Okay. So this part, this 604B is not going to have anything to do with actual physical weed management. Oh, it won't. Okay. But in order to apply for the grant that will be about weed management, we have to do this first. Okay. But we're just focusing on the 604B now. And the other one is a 319. That'll be some later. 319. Okay. So I'm going to call this, I'll rephrase the motion. I'm going to call it a feasibility study on nutrient sources for, I'll just leave it at that, nutrients, flora and nutrient sources on Dudley Pond. I'll leave it at that. I don't know if this belongs in the motion, but I would be happy to serve as the, since I'm kind of on this committee anyway, HDBC, I would be happy to serve as the liaison to this committee for that work. Okay. That's, that's fine. That doesn't need to be, that doesn't need to be part of the motion. What if we, um, if approved, uh, and if the ball gets rolling, you can be that, that conduit between Anne's committee and our, our committee. All right. So let me, uh, go back and make the motion. So, uh, before the committee, uh, is a motion to submit on behalf of the Dudley Pond Association, a 604B grant, uh, for a feasibility study, uh, on nutrient sources, uh, for, um, weed management on Dudley Pond in, uh, in 20, for it to be submitted in 2027. Yeah. I'll second. Thank you. And let's do, go around the virtual room for, uh, we'll call vote. Tom Largy, aye. Steve Garone, aye. Tom Klem, aye. Awesome. Thanks, Anne. So we'll, um, as we have our meetings going forward, we can have you back when Wendy gets her report in, or as we, as the 604B business gets off the ground, you or anybody on the committee will have you come back and give updates or just converse, whatever. Okay. Okay. Sure. That sounds great. Awesome. Good. I have a non-business question to ask, Anne. Were you out on the pond last night? I think you were. Yeah, we were. We were struggling because our engine's been having trouble. So we were doing little circles in front of our house with the hope that we weren't going to have to paddle back. We had, we had a full moon party last night on the pond. It was amazing. Anyway. Yeah. We did. I told you it was non-business. Yeah. Yeah. It was great. All right, Anne. Thank you so much. We didn't want to come all the way over to you guys because we were afraid you would not have to tow us back. We were going to have to ask you to tow us back and we didn't want to interfere with the moon sighting. Got it. Okay. All right. Thanks, Anne. Okay. Thank you. Have a good night. Bye. All right. Take care. Bye.
All right. Moving on to Herd Pun. And Tom Larga, do you want to start with your, with the update on what the water chestnuts are looking like? Yeah, right. Per my note, I did not go out personally. I've been struggling with a couple of things. One is my, my, my shoulder. The, and I would, I can't take my small boat out. I flat can't. Turns out my larger boat has a whole saga with that. And, uh, but, um, I I'm in shape, but, uh, uh, I was telling Steve Garone a little bit of that, uh, anyway, uh, but this fellow, uh, Josh, uh, hurting who lives in the, uh, large house at the, uh, end of, uh, Pelham Island road and, uh, Landon road as a garage, uh, a barn there. He's got a pineapple painted on it. He's got a bass boat inside. He's, um, on the, uh, pond, um, easily a hundred or more days a year. So, um, and I've been out with him a couple of times. So I, I trust his observation and, uh, uh, uh, and simply, uh, put, uh, on the open water areas, it's sporadic. That's about what, uh, I've come up with in past years. And, uh, he felt the, uh, South Cove might not be, uh, quite as infested, but nevertheless, where it is infested, uh, you know, there are mats of, uh, uh, of, uh, water chestnut plants on the surface, uh, Tom Klem's been out there with me. He knows what we're talking about. So, um, it's, it's very simple. Uh, uh, they should start, uh, the clear cast treatment right away for the first of the treatments and, uh, start her harvesting. Uh, uh, I was, uh, was it this morning? Yeah, I was there this morning. Saw that, um, water chestnut rosette, uh, washed up, uh, must have been. And somebody out with a boat and this is in the launch area and, uh, it's only the end of June, but, uh, uh, uh, the plants are well along in maturity. Uh, the pond's been, uh, uh, very low water level for, uh, some weeks now as has been the, uh, Sudbury river. There's just plenty of drought going on and, uh, it's likely that, uh, there are going to be lots more plants. Uh, that's all there is to it. It's, uh, uh, we should start treatment or harvesting on the pond as soon as possible. Tom, question on the, on the timing. I know when they did clear cast last year, they did two treatments a couple of weeks apart. Should, is, uh, is your recommendation that we do the clear cast first, both applications and then what's done that have the crews come in and do the hand pulling? No, I, I, I would say the, uh, crew should do the hand pulling as, uh, as soon as possible. And it has to do with biomass, uh, as these, uh, uh, what's a single rosette now in, uh, just two or three or four weeks could be, uh, a, uh, a daisy chain of rosettes. And, uh, uh, so, uh, uh, it's, the biomass is a whole lot less right now than it is, than it will be, uh, later in July. I think they should start immediately because they generally have, because I don't want them to do, because I think it would be disruptive. You can tell me otherwise, if they were to do some hand harvesting now, then they do the first treatment of clear cast and the guys come in and pull plants up. Can these things overlap or do they? No, I, I don't see any overlap. Those are entirely different parts of the pond. Um, uh, so you're saying, okay, so the clear cast is going to be South Cove. The hand harvesting is everywhere else. Everywhere else. Yeah. Okay. There's, uh, there's no conflict whatsoever. Okay. Perfect. Okay. I will get the word out to, uh, Jeff and, uh, Tanner. Those contracts have been signed. If I didn't send those to you guys, apologies, I'll make, I'll check and I'll send them to you as you have them. Um, okay. Uh, and then this is, thank you, Tom. I appreciate that. So I will get in touch with those guys. Both contracts have been signed at the last meeting when we last meeting, I reported on the phone call that I had with Stephanie Koch, uh, Koch and Tanner and Solitude and Emily Cuellar from conservation was there. So, uh, the first thing was that, uh, to expand the scope of clear cast treatment would require, uh, a special permit from the fish and wildlife service, which, uh, we're not going to be able to do this year. They're swamped. We'll apply for it in the fall. So we have it for next year. So we're going to be within the confines of herd pond as we were last year. Uh, but I did give Stephanie the news that we're going to hand harvest. She gave me the thumbs up, said, thank you for letting me know. So we have there. Okay. So we're, we're good to go on, uh, the hand harvesting for the clear cast. And what I didn't realize last year when we got approval was that that was only good for one year. I assumed it was for a window of time, like with Priscilla core, Emily Cuellar made me aware that, no, you only had it for last year, not for this year. So I had to go before concom, which was the day, day after we last met and I explained the situation and they gave me the approval. In fact, I'm like, I don't think Linda sent me to know yet, but we do have the approval to do clear cast again this year. Uh, I'll follow up with Linda to get that note. So we are all clear to engage in these activities. So Tom, I'll take the lead and reach out to, uh, Tanner and Jeff and have those guys scrounge up whoever they can. Who's got a boat, a canoe, a paddleboard, and just get out there and start laying waste of this stuff. Okay. Tom, I am grateful that you did all of that. Uh, thank you. Oh, you're welcome. It was, like I said, it's, it's emails, it's meetings. It's, it's pretty light, light lift. I know it's a bureaucracy kind of thing and a pain, but I guess I'm used to it for my, for my job. Glad to help out.
All right. Uh, I think that was it. Our usual big two. Let's see. Contract status. Clear cast. Well, uh, a point of, uh, uh, well, that's all for heard, but, uh, back to Dudley, uh, when is the, uh, Steve, when do you think the harvesting will start for, uh, uh, uh, for tape grass? Uh, I think, um, what I heard was, um, first or second week of July, my guess would be after next week, but I could be off by a few days. I, I don't remember. Yeah. I think that's early to mid July. And, you know, I, based on what I've seen out there, um, that's good because I think the tape grass is going to be a major issue soon, very soon, but it isn't right at this minute. In fact, when I look at my propeller, when I come back, it's all the other weed, you know? The other weed, so not in the milfoil? No. Um, the. What's, what's, what's popping up now? Um, why am I not remembering? Clasping something? Pearly leaf pond weed. Pearly leaf. Thank you. Okay. Yeah. Okay. Uh, which is, which is not as disruptive to motors as tape grass, but it's still, still not great. Well, I was out on the pond, as I was mentioning to Steve, uh, I, uh, uh, had to get a boat in and off. And, uh, uh, my observation was I, uh, the route I took, uh, I didn't see any tape grass to, uh, uh, speak of. I saw quite a bit of other weeds and my prop was similarly, uh, uh, uh, is just loaded with lots of stuff, uh, that was taking it in off mention beach.
Yeah. So, you know, I think, I think the fact that it hasn't been started yet is probably good, but I'm seeing signs of it. So. Is this, is this curly leaf is now sort of the, the next thing, you know, just taking over the tape grass. So we had the tape grass take over the milfoil. Well, now this curly leaf is out competing tape grass or it's just a new player in the mix. I think, I think the, the curly leaf is going to, uh, sort of not die out, but become less, less relevant than tape grass over the next week or two. Uh, yeah, that's, uh, as long as I've been on the committee, uh, you know, there've been discussions on this going way back when it was just milfoil versus curly leaf. The curly leaf, uh, uh, seems pretty prevalent, but apparently it dies back, uh, very early in July. And that's, uh, okay. The grass is coming. All right. Awesome. All right. Uh, that is our agenda for the day. I'd like to discuss, uh, a next meeting date and I'm looking at a second week of August cause I'll be gone the first week. So, uh, 10th, 11th and 12th, that's a Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, and August. Okay. Let me pull up my calendar. I already know that we'll be, uh, around, uh, we'll be away, uh, in a mid July, but, uh, I'm not going anywhere in early August. I don't think I am either. Tom, that mid July trip, is that the one that you were going to, you're still going to go, but now it's, you're not going to be able to fish. Well, I, I, I was at a physical therapist, uh, today. And, uh, uh, uh, I, I, I went in to see the surgeon that I, I may have, I don't know if I, about three weeks ago. And he, uh, this is, um, you know, the, uh, what the heck was, uh, and, um, he said, well, we could, you could do surgery, but that wouldn't be very much fun. And, uh, maybe you can, um, uh, uh, my, uh, uh, what the heck is it? Uh, why do I always forget on my shoulder? Or what do they call that, uh, uh, rotator cuff, rotator cuff, hanging by a thread. Uh, I hear, I hear everybody's got that problem lately. Everybody I've talked to. Well, I was, uh, fly fishing today, uh, just to prove that I can, and I can't do it as well, but I can do it. So, um, I, uh, uh, uh, you know, I've, I've got a big fly fishing trip out to Washington State, uh, uh, week long, the end of September. So that, that's, that's a big deal. We'll be on the river all day, every day, making hundreds of casts. And, um, uh, so, uh, I, I'm hoping, I'm hoping I shape up from that. It's been pointed out, pointed out that maybe I should, uh, I don't know if, uh, oh, there's an issue with, uh, oh, stamina and wearing out the arm and this and that. So maybe I'd just take half as many casts. I don't know. Go along for the boat ride. But, uh, anyway, I sent a check in today for a portion of the trip, which.
Okay. So what dates did you say, Tom? Uh, I'm looking at Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, August 10, 11, 12. Okay. Okay. Well, so any of them will work for me, but I want to, again, say that once the fall rolls around, uh, second Tuesday of the month and every Wednesday will not be available. All right. Well, we'll, we'll deal with that in the fall, but right now. So let's. Summertime, it's okay. So, so let's go with Tuesday then, because we more or less be on Tuesday. So Tom Largie, August 11th, Tuesday. Yeah. August 11th, a Tuesday. Now, Larry Kiernan is not on. Um, I, um, I don't know what his schedule will be, uh, hard to say, but it's fine with me. Tuesday will. All right. So let's, so let me, why don't you, so what I'll do is I'll, I'll send Larry a text. Uh, let me know, both of you, uh, are the 10th and the 12th also going to work? I mean, 11th will be my priority, but if Larry can do, can't do that, but he can do the 10th or the 12th, does that work for you guys? Yeah, yeah, that's fine. They all work. Okay. So I'll prioritize the 11th, but if Larry can only meet one of the other days and we'll meet on one of those other days. Okay. Awesome. Uh, I think we broke a time record, didn't we? Uh, pretty close to it. 45 minutes is a pretty, pretty tight and concise meeting. Um, guys have a great 4th of July. I moved to adjourn. Okay. Not yet. I'm saying my, I'm sorry. I thought you would say goodbye. So I'm like, you can't do that. No, I gotta make a motion. So you can make them. Okay. So that was my glad tidings for you all. Uh, Steve, you want to make a motion to adjourn at 7 46 PM? I guess I kind of did. I still hear thunder. Uh, I make a motion to adjourn at 7 46 PM. It's our second. I'll second it. All right. Thank you. Uh, let's go around the room. Tom Largy. I see your own.